@ShaquilleOatmeal said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@frugby said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

Parker an interesting one. They clearly feel they need the archetype, but don't feel he is ready to go just yet. I wouldn't be surprised if he is again unused this week - but to me it makes it highly likely they want to get Frizell back involved.

The loose forwards remain the area I'm least sure about and they also seem to be the area the coaches are least sure about. What's the best combination? Are all the jobs being covered? Who plays where? How will a smaller trio fare against South Africa? And if Jacobson is out, we'll see yet another combination this weekend. That could give Parker an opportunity, either as a starter or off the bench.

I don't think we have the balance right as yet in our loose forward mix. I'm far from convinced by Ardie as captain - and player for that matter. LJ and Segner were far more effective hitting rucks, moving bodies and turning ball over...Ardie is planly in the twilight of his career, sure no-one doubts his commitment, but there are other more effective players and ball carriers.
Segner has been a revelation this season winning and contessting LOs, carrying strongly and turning over ball. I would like to see him at 7, LJ (If fit) at 6 and Lakai at 8..

I reckon Segner gets a start this weekend. Probably 6, LJ 7 and Ardie at 8. Lakai on bench.

If I were selecting my pack would be:

EDG/Taylor/Lomax/Darry/Vaa'i/LukeJ/Parker/RD

Bench: Numia/Aumua/Tosi/Patty T/Lakai

@Jailbreak7 said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@ShaquilleOatmeal said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@frugby said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

Parker an interesting one. They clearly feel they need the archetype, but don't feel he is ready to go just yet. I wouldn't be surprised if he is again unused this week - but to me it makes it highly likely they want to get Frizell back involved.

The loose forwards remain the area I'm least sure about and they also seem to be the area the coaches are least sure about. What's the best combination? Are all the jobs being covered? Who plays where? How will a smaller trio fare against South Africa? And if Jacobson is out, we'll see yet another combination this weekend. That could give Parker an opportunity, either as a starter or off the bench.

I don't think we have the balance right as yet in our loose forward mix. I'm far from convinced by Ardie as captain - and player for that matter. LJ and Segner were far more effective hitting rucks, moving bodies and turning ball over...Ardie is planly in the twilight of his career, sure no-one doubts his commitment, but there are other more effective players and ball carriers.
Segner has been a revelation this season winning and contessting LOs, carrying strongly and turning over ball. I would like to see him at 7, LJ (If fit) at 6 and Lakai at 8..

I think Ardie hit close to 50 rucks against the French. It was a key part of the reason we got such quick ball.

He also made the most carries that game.

Even though he came off early against Italy he was top 4 for both carries and tackles.

To do that while clearly needing a rest and after an jnjury early in the game shows he's still a vital component of the team.

@pakman said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

If I were selecting my pack would be:

EDG/Taylor/Lomax/Darry/Vaa'i/LukeJ/Parker/RD

Bench: Numia/Aumua/Tosi/Patty T/Lakai

Parker would have to be the worst openside of all the loosies and not sure we're ready for Numia at hooker or Aumua at prop.

@voodoo said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@Dan54 said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@Landers92 said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@Dan54 said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@antipodean said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@voodoo said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@antipodean said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

Backline:

9 - Roigard

10 - Love

11 - Clarke

12 - Tupaea

13 - Proctor

14 - Jordan

15 - McKenzie

Looks good but I'd give Moorby another go - reward the performance, and put Clarke on notice that it's better to draw and pass than to clatter into ther last defender...

I'd prefer Moorby too given his performance last week and Clarke's been carrying a niggle. If Clarke is 100% though, I'd like a power winger back in the side - he's been good at looking for work around rucks previously.

I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Beauden start at fullback either. He'd be one of the last backs not to get any time on the field prior to them assembling for South Africa.

I can see BB getting a run at 15, we need to look at being able to change things a bit.

By change things, do you mean kick the ball away aimlessly?

I don't pretend to be expert enough to know what or how the coaching team is thinking.

Don't stress Dan, we have you covered on this

Thank god mate!!

Paul Cully is predicting that Vaa'i will be named at 6.

@Bovidae said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

Paul Cully is predicting that Vaa'i will be named at 6.

That would be three quite different players in three consecutive tests. Either they're searching for the best loose forward balance, or they genuinely believe all those players can perform the same role.

Hopefully something just clicks, because there isn't much time to give three players (or even four if Parker gets a go too) significant game time before South Africa.

@shaquilleoatmeal there's still the three fixtures before the first Test.

@antipodean said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@shaquilleoatmealthere's still the three fixtures before the first Test.

Is that enough time to find the best blindside option - two games max each?

@shaquilleoatmeal said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@antipodean said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@shaquilleoatmealthere's still the three fixtures before the first Test.

Is that enough time to find the best blindside option - two games max each?

I think six fixtures is sufficient time to determine your best loose forward trio and bench - training and game data should give you enough to go on.

I mean if not by then, when?

I wonder if vaai training at 6 was to keep him ready to cover again so they can bring on a lock?
Maybe inject paddy (amusing fit) to muscle out last 20min.
I still have a feeling parker starts at 6

@antipodean said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@shaquilleoatmeal said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@antipodean said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@shaquilleoatmealthere's still the three fixtures before the first Test.

Is that enough time to find the best blindside option - two games max each?

I think six fixtures is sufficient time to determine your best loose forward trio and bench - training and game data should give you enough to go on.

I mean if not by then, when?

I think it would be if you already had a rough idea of your best trio - and Rennie might - but whether Lakai, Sititi, Vaa’i or Parker is the right option at blindside could take some time to work out if they’re starting with a clean slate. There could be an obvious standout before the first South Africa test though. They might already be able to rule out Sititi.

@Jnr said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@Jailbreak7 said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@ShaquilleOatmeal said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@frugby said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

Parker an interesting one. They clearly feel they need the archetype, but don't feel he is ready to go just yet. I wouldn't be surprised if he is again unused this week - but to me it makes it highly likely they want to get Frizell back involved.

The loose forwards remain the area I'm least sure about and they also seem to be the area the coaches are least sure about. What's the best combination? Are all the jobs being covered? Who plays where? How will a smaller trio fare against South Africa? And if Jacobson is out, we'll see yet another combination this weekend. That could give Parker an opportunity, either as a starter or off the bench.

I don't think we have the balance right as yet in our loose forward mix. I'm far from convinced by Ardie as captain - and player for that matter. LJ and Segner were far more effective hitting rucks, moving bodies and turning ball over...Ardie is planly in the twilight of his career, sure no-one doubts his commitment, but there are other more effective players and ball carriers.
Segner has been a revelation this season winning and contessting LOs, carrying strongly and turning over ball. I would like to see him at 7, LJ (If fit) at 6 and Lakai at 8..

I think Ardie hit close to 50 rucks against the French. It was a key part of the reason we got such quick ball.

He also made the most carries that game.

Even though he came off early against Italy he was top 4 for both carries and tackles.

To do that while clearly needing a rest and after an jnjury early in the game shows he's still a vital component of the team.

Did he really? That would be great if so - but it is a hell of a lot more rucks than usual, he averaged about 15 per 80 minutes for Moana.
Against Italy he was 4th for carries per minute and 7th for tackles per minute. Wallace Sititi - who had the worst game in the history of the known universe - was 3rd and 5th (without the advantage of playing for a shorter period).

He was 9th and 12th vs France when playing 80 (which illustrates the per minute advantage of guys who play part-games).

I'm not particularly down on him, but those carry and tackles per minute vs France are about the same as what he did for Moana, so I'd be very surprised if he kept that workload the same but hit 3 times the amount of rucks.

The loose forward balance, and even what they're aiming for, remains a bit of a mystery to me.

@reprobate said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

Did he really? That would be great if so - but it is a hell of a lot more rucks than usual, he averaged about 15 per 80 minutes for Moana.

It would mean he attended a third of attacking rucks (deduced from carries). I find that difficult to believe, especially the "hit" bit.

yeah "rucks attended" is the dumbest stat

@ShaquilleOatmeal said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@antipodean said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@shaquilleoatmeal said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@antipodean said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@shaquilleoatmealthere's still the three fixtures before the first Test.

Is that enough time to find the best blindside option - two games max each?

I think six fixtures is sufficient time to determine your best loose forward trio and bench - training and game data should give you enough to go on.

I mean if not by then, when?

I think it would be if you already had a rough idea of your best trio - and Rennie might - but whether Lakai, Sititi, Vaa’i or Parker is the right option at blindside could take some time to work out if they’re starting with a clean slate. There could be an obvious standout before the first South Africa test though. They might already be able to rule out Sititi.

This is the thing, it looks kinda like they really don't know because those players are all pretty different.

Sititi is an okay lineout forward. A medium sized wide volume carrier and tackler. Not a ruck hitter.
Lakai is not really a lineout forward, a medium sized solid generalist, a bit of a jackal threat. A medium-low ruck hitter.
Parker is a good lineout target, a medium volume tackler, not a carrier. Is a ruck hitter.
Vaa'i is a very good lineout target, not a volume tackler or carrier, is a ruck hitter.
Segner is a decent lineout target, not a volume carrier or tackler. Accurate generalist, a bit of a jackal threat. A medium-low ruck hitter.

Rennie says he wants complementary skillsets, but then he's selected a squad without like-for-like replacements, and he's picked Jacobson and Savea to start then matched them with different skillsets. That makes it look like the skillset balance remains unknown. Maybe there are two separate horses-for-courses plans, one with Vaai/Parker, and one with Sititi/Lakai. But even Sititi and Lakai don't really play the same game.

It's also interesting that after Jacobson, the best ruck numbers - by quite a way - belong to Parker. That might point to Parker playing if Jacobson doesn't.

Landers mate.
Where's the team?

@Frank said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

Landers mate.
Where's the team?

I had it locked and ready to go but the Jordie injury has thrown a spanner in the works.

I’ll post what it was going to be anyway, I’m sure it will spark some discussion.

9. Roigard
10. Love
11. Moorby
12. J. Barrett
13. Tupaea
14. Jordan
15. Dmac

Bench
21. Ratima
22. ALB
23. Clarke

All subject to change now due to the JB injury obviously.

@Landers92 said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

@Frank said in NC: All Blacks v Ireland:

Landers mate.
Where's the team?

I had it locked and ready to go but the Jordie injury has thrown a spanner in the works.

I’ll post what it was going to be anyway, I’m sure it will spark some discussion.

9. Roigard
10. Love
11. Moorby
12. J. Barrett
13. Tupaea
14. Jordan
15. Dmac

Bench
21. Ratima
22. ALB
23. Clarke

All subject to change now due to the JB injury obviously.

If Barrett is out, logic says we'll see a Tupaea/ALB midfield with Proctor on the bench.

But Rennie could throw a spanner in the works and keep Tupaea at 13 if he wants him to clock up more miles there. I'm not a fan of ALB at 12 so would rather this doesn't happen.

Or ALB could remain bench cover with Proctor coming in at 13.

And just want to say I'm very pleased that we've not seen Beauden Barrett at all during the series. Already a big tick for Rennie in my books.