@Steven-Harris said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@nostrildamus has all the tools to play international rugby but tackling is a non negotiable when your the last line of defence
All Blacks in the past have managed to hide the odd first five in defence but your fullback has to be courageous when it comes to defence
Staggered league were looking at him

Oh come on, Jordan is no defensive powerhouse.

@Bones said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

but supposedly Plummer was average.

No prizes for guessing which poster thought this

@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@Bones said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

but supposedly Plummer was average.

No prizes for guessing which poster thought this

I have not verified if anyone else said this but I did so I'll vouch for myself.

When I wrote this it was completely valid.

He kicked a penalty dead, knocked it on with no pressure around him, and was losing metres ball in hand when carrying.

He at least got a nice intercept.

@kpkanz featured heavily in the highlights, was lovely to see a backline going forward and finding space.

I watched the game. Plummer first 20 minutes were genuinely horrible, after that he was pretty good.

@Bones said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@kpkanz featured heavily in the highlights, was lovely to see a backline going forward and finding space.

I watched the full game not just the highlights.

That first pass to Lam for the try and his intercept are the sole positive things he did the entire game, they were an outlier rather than the norm.

What you didn't see were the errors and poor carrying.

But you won't trust my analysis which is fine.

(and the first 30 mins he was genuinely horrible which is when I left my comment, he at least improved after that)

@kpkanz I imagine your analysis of Plummer is about as trustworthy as my analysis of Jordan, which is fine.

@Nepia said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

NZR+ made this match replay hard to find. I was looking all over the place then eventually found in the carousel after scrolling past a few docos.

I'm not impressed with NZR navigation...

@Toddy The penalty try was a ridiculous call.

Yeah the highlights were the complete opposite for the ref.

I thought it was a good, entertaining game. Munster really showed up in front of a big crowd at Thomond Park. I'm always surprised at some of the crowds the Irish are able to muster for these kinds of exhibition games. Their U20s also regularly play for crowds of 7000+ people.

On Plummer, I think he really benefits from a secondary playmaker in the backline, like Perofeta or Sullivan at the Blues, especially in the face of an agressive defensive line like Munster's. With Stevenson at fullback and Tupaea at second five, there wasn't a whole lot of secondary playmaking going on. Stevenson can act as a playmaker but he didn't get much involved in this game. The Georgia game might see Love or even Jacomb get a start at fullback (if Love isn't available).

And finally, the refereeing was pretty shocking at times. Not quite as bad as Craig Evans in the Scotland Fiji game, but some of the decision-making (like the Farrell-try or the Kirifi-non try) was genuinely ridiculous. Without some of these decisions, you'd think the gap would've been substantially bigger between these two sides.

@Mauss said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

I thought it was a good, entertaining game. Munster really showed up in front of a big crowd at Thomond Park. I'm always surprised at some of the crowds the Irish are able to muster for these kinds of exhibition games. Their U20s also regularly play for crowds of 7000+ people.

On Plummer, I think he really benefits from a secondary playmaker in the backline, like Perofeta or Sullivan at the Blues, especially in the face of an agressive defensive line like Munster's. With Stevenson at fullback and Tupaea at second five, there wasn't a whole lot of secondary playmaking going on. Stevenson can act as a playmaker but he didn't get much involved in this game. The Georgia game might see Love or even Jacomb get a start at fullback (if Love isn't available).

Which of the XV looked AB-level ready?

@nostrildamus That's tough to gauge. Munster played well but you can't say they presented test-level opposition.

From the uncapped guys, I'd probably say Fabian Holland and AJ Lam. Holland is a great athlete who stepped up the intensity of his play and Lam showed some nice subtle touches to go along with great physicality in the midfield.

Munster defended better than Fiji did in SD.

@Mauss said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@nostrildamus That's tough to gauge. Munster played well but you can't say they presented test-level opposition.

From the uncapped guys, I'd probably say Fabian Holland and AJ Lam. Holland is a great athlete who stepped up the intensity of his play and Lam showed some nice subtle touches to go along with great physicality in the midfield.

I noticed Holland's combination of physicality and footwork -impressive stepping for such a big man.*

*Not sure why I typed big Indian bread, ok, now corrected.

@nostrildamus said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@Mauss said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@nostrildamus That's tough to gauge. Munster played well but you can't say they presented test-level opposition.

From the uncapped guys, I'd probably say Fabian Holland and AJ Lam. Holland is a great athlete who stepped up the intensity of his play and Lam showed some nice subtle touches to go along with great physicality in the midfield.

I noticed Holland's combination of physicality and footwork -impressive stepping for such a big nan.

Definitely would be.

@kpkanz said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@Bones said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@kpkanz featured heavily in the highlights, was lovely to see a backline going forward and finding space.

I watched the full game not just the highlights.

That first pass to Lam for the try and his intercept are the sole positive things he did the entire game, they were an outlier rather than the norm.

What you didn't see were the errors and poor carrying.

But you won't trust my analysis which is fine.

(and the first 30 mins he was genuinely horrible which is when I left my comment, he at least improved after that)

Nonsense. I also watched the whole game and I saw a fluid backline when they got the ball. Something the ABs struggled with all year. A lot of that came down to the halves and the midfield.

Plummer also kicked his goals well.

@brodean Yeah but we're talking about playing against a midweek club team. With a different coach in McMillan coaching the backline attack and a completely different midfield to work with.

I don't know why we're extrapolating the 'fluidity' of the backline as if it's telling us anything about what these guys would do in the All Blacks environment.

I blame most of the lack of 'fluidity' in the backline in the All Blacks to our current top midfield pairing anyway.

Holland was very good and I wish McMillan was part of the the ABs set up. His teams always seem to focus on the physicality side of the breakdown battle. His battles with Razor in SR were games within games.

@kpkanz said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@brodean Yeah but we're talking about playing against a midweek club team. With a different coach in McMillan coaching the backline attack and a completely different midfield to work with.

I don't know why we're extrapolating the 'fluidity' of the backline as if it's telling us anything about what these guys would do in the All Blacks environment.

I blame most of the lack of 'fluidity' in the backline in the All Blacks to our current top midfield pairing anyway.

It's a scratch team that have never played before. The ABs have had 10 games to get some fluidity but we aren't seeing it.

I agree that the current AB midfield options are an issue and I think that's relevant. We should be considering players in form. Half of Razor's issues are picking players out of form.

@brodean said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@kpkanz said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@brodean Yeah but we're talking about playing against a midweek club team. With a different coach in McMillan coaching the backline attack and a completely different midfield to work with.

I don't know why we're extrapolating the 'fluidity' of the backline as if it's telling us anything about what these guys would do in the All Blacks environment.

I blame most of the lack of 'fluidity' in the backline in the All Blacks to our current top midfield pairing anyway.

It's a scratch team that have never played before. The ABs have had 10 games to get some fluidity but we aren't seeing it.

I agree that the current AB midfield options are an issue and I think that's relevant. We should be considering players in form. Half of Razor's issues are picking players out of form.

That's overstating it a bit, BB has played what 1 game at 10 this year, and that was paired with TJ?
Not that I really think time would help.

@reprobate said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@brodean said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@kpkanz said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@brodean Yeah but we're talking about playing against a midweek club team. With a different coach in McMillan coaching the backline attack and a completely different midfield to work with.

I don't know why we're extrapolating the 'fluidity' of the backline as if it's telling us anything about what these guys would do in the All Blacks environment.

I blame most of the lack of 'fluidity' in the backline in the All Blacks to our current top midfield pairing anyway.

It's a scratch team that have never played before. The ABs have had 10 games to get some fluidity but we aren't seeing it.

I agree that the current AB midfield options are an issue and I think that's relevant. We should be considering players in form. Half of Razor's issues are picking players out of form.

That's overstating it a bit, BB has played what 1 game at 10 this year, and that was paired with TJ?
Not that I really think time would help.

They've all been in the squad training together for 4 or 5 months while ABs XV have been together for a week. BB would be training at 10 at times since they first all got together in July because he is 10 cover. Ratima has started a bunch of games now.

@nostrildamus said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@Mauss said in All Blacks XV v Munster:

@nostrildamus That's tough to gauge. Munster played well but you can't say they presented test-level opposition.

From the uncapped guys, I'd probably say Fabian Holland and AJ Lam. Holland is a great athlete who stepped up the intensity of his play and Lam showed some nice subtle touches to go along with great physicality in the midfield.

I noticed Holland's combination of physicality and footwork -impressive stepping for such a big nan.

Only saw the highlights and he looked really good.

Huge as well.

He has a very big future that boy.

Definite AB next July (stay healthy )

Video of the haka is on the FB page. Silence from the crowd, led by Renata.