@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

@Tim said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

Start the Hurricanes front row with Tosi starting or on bench. Vaai replaces Lord. Taukei'aho on the bench. Segner on the bench. Might need to manage Savea's minutes, so 6-2 split?

Wouldn't be surprised if Clarke picked up an injury before being subbed against France.

Think we'll see minimal changes in the starting XV. But maybe quite a few on the bench. Preston in for Ratima.

Who captains if RD is subbed? Jordie?

I don't disagree with having Preston ahead of Ratima in the pecking order but what's the point in dropping Ratima after playing just five minutes?

Missed tackles on Saturday

5 @37.5% Damian Mckenzie
3 @66% Quinn Tuapaea
3 @72% Xavier Numia
2 @81% Jordie Barrett
2 @71% Peter Lakai
2 @89% Sam Darry
1 @75% Caleb Clarke

Of all the guys you could talk about who had poor defence on Saturday.

@brodean "Lost on defence" = provincialism.

The defense certainly needs major improvement in this match so we are ready to face Ireland.

Just for context this French team made 12 line breaks which is 1 more line break than the Boks made last year when they hammered us with a record score.

MIssed tackles stats dont always tell the whole story.

I mean you are positioned wrong, and dont even get near someone, you havent missed a tackle, but if the guy inside/outside you then comes across to cover for you but misses, then he gets the missed tackle.

Similarly, FB's will often feature higher as they are often the guy called on to cover after someone else has missed, all about context, but I am sure the coaches look at that in thier analysis too.

I'll be a bit disappointed if they give Tupaea one game at 13 then drop him from there.

Any Chiefs fan will tell you that he hardly plays there for us, so to expect him to walk in and be world class at defence (in probably the hardest position to be world class in at defence), is pretty unfair on the Super rugby player of the year.

He's a 12 who can stretch to 13, and if they want him to be WC there, he needs as many games as possible to start there so he can build his understanding.

Not every good performance is defined by the winning margin. This week, I'd make defence the key performance indicator. If they keep Italy's score down through disciplined, accurate defence, that's a better sign of progress than simply racking up points themselves.

@taniwharugby

Yes, centers are often used to shoot up and close down space, which leads to missed tackles recorded but not defensive lapses. Tupaea didn't do that though. It would be better to look at the root cause of the defensive problems than blame your least favourite team's wing.

Tupaea might successfully convert from 12 (where is very good) to 13, but his defensive lapses won't go away immediately.

We also need to get better at tackling and slowing down the opposition rucks.

@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

MIssed tackles stats dont always tell the whole story.

I mean you are positioned wrong, and dont even get near someone, you havent missed a tackle, but if the guy inside/outside you then comes across to cover for you but misses, then he gets the missed tackle.

Yes. You have to attempt a tackle to miss one. But getting stepped or beaten has the same effect.

@Tim I was talking generally, not about any one player.

Agree, plenty to work on, but probably more to feel positive about in that 80 mins than we saw in the past 2 seasons.

re the suggestions of QT at 12....i think if hes a serious option at 13 then he was less than perfect on sat and so a few games in a row would be good, moving him immediately doen't let him settle

@Kiwiwomble Agreed. If the coaches have a clear idea of how they want to play and which players best suit that style, they can't start chopping and changing every week or at the first sign someone isn't perfect. That applies to Tupaea at centre, the loose forward trio I still don't like and everything else. This is the fifth or sixth time I've said it, but they need to find their best lineup (which may well require some tinkering) and give it time to develop.

Ardie should start and it should be at no8. Sure sub him off if they don’t want him to go the distance. But moving Lakai to 8 would make no sense at this early juncture after playing him at blindside in the opener. Lakai played 50 odd minutes, maybe this week sub off the 7 or 8 and try a different combo to close things out.

@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

Ardie should start and it should be at no8. Sure sub him off if they don’t want him to go the distance. But moving Lakai to 8 would make no sense at this early juncture after playing him at blindside in the opener. Lakai played 50 odd minutes, maybe this week sub off the 7 or 8 and try a different combo to close things out.

With a similar lineup, they're perfectly suited to a 6:2 bench split. It'd be very easy this weekend to sub Savea at half-time without also having to shift Jacobson or Lakai - assuming they're starting again - and still give one of them a rest too.

Looking like the forecast for this game has improved dramatically (for now). No wind and only a small chance of a shower.

@gt12 said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

I'll be a bit disappointed if they give Tupaea one game at 13 then drop him from there.

Any Chiefs fan will tell you that he hardly plays there for us, so to expect him to walk in and be world class at defence (in probably the hardest position to be world class in at defence), is pretty unfair on the Super rugby player of the year.

He's a 12 who can stretch to 13, and if they want him to be WC there, he needs as many games as possible to start there so he can build his understanding.

He should be playing there at Super level if he wants to be 13. Test rugbys not the place you learn the ropes at 13.

13 is a specialist role.

@brodean 3 tests as a starter at 13 and 3 wins. He’s also come off the bench and played 13 off the bench.

Aren’t all the positions specialist?

@brodean said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

@gt12 said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

I'll be a bit disappointed if they give Tupaea one game at 13 then drop him from there.

Any Chiefs fan will tell you that he hardly plays there for us, so to expect him to walk in and be world class at defence (in probably the hardest position to be world class in at defence), is pretty unfair on the Super rugby player of the year.

He's a 12 who can stretch to 13, and if they want him to be WC there, he needs as many games as possible to start there so he can build his understanding.

He should be playing there at Super level if he wants to be 13. Test rugbys not the place you learn the ropes at 13.

13 is a specialist role.

I actually agree with this, but the current coaches want him at 13, and the truth is that the ABs are not just a rep side, they also develop players to be what they want at the international level.

We can hate that all we want, but I think it's a reality.

My point is that if the coaches want him to be a solid international level 13, he's going to make mistakes. If that is where they are going, then I'd prefer him to have as many games as possible, especially against Italy where the threat shouldn't be as high as against France. Those are the games where he needs to be in the 13 shirt if that is their plan.

Thinking a bit more about the team and last weekend’s lineup, I’d make at most one change in the backs: Clarke out for Fineanganofo and even that is a maybe.

Beyond that, I’m not convinced by the loose forwards mix but if the coaches have a clear plan and believe those are the right players to execute it, they should stick with the same trio to start.

Elsewhere in the forwards, I’d bring Vaa’i in if he’s available and start Aumua and/or Numia. On the bench, I’d include Taukei’aho and Tosi, along with an extra loose forward rather than a specialist wing.

And I'd like to see plenty of early substitutions.

@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

@brodean 3 tests as a starter at 13 and 3 wins. He’s also come off the bench and played 13 off the bench.

Aren’t all the positions specialist?

He was exposed badly when he came off the bench against SA last year

@gt12 said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

@brodean said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

@gt12 said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

I'll be a bit disappointed if they give Tupaea one game at 13 then drop him from there.

Any Chiefs fan will tell you that he hardly plays there for us, so to expect him to walk in and be world class at defence (in probably the hardest position to be world class in at defence), is pretty unfair on the Super rugby player of the year.

He's a 12 who can stretch to 13, and if they want him to be WC there, he needs as many games as possible to start there so he can build his understanding.

He should be playing there at Super level if he wants to be 13. Test rugbys not the place you learn the ropes at 13.

13 is a specialist role.

I actually agree with this, but the current coaches want him at 13, and the truth is that the ABs are not just a rep side, they also develop players to be what they want at the international level.

We can hate that all we want, but I think it's a reality.

My point is that if the coaches want him to be a solid international level 13, he's going to make mistakes. If that is where they are going, then I'd prefer him to have as many games as possible, especially against Italy where the threat shouldn't be as high as against France. Those are the games where he needs to be in the 13 shirt if that is their plan.

One thing I don't like about this approach is it can create an unfair assessment of a player. They may not perform to the required standards in an unfamiliar position and then it impacts the perception of them in their preferred position too.

@brodean said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

He should be playing there at Super level if he wants to be 13.

Except it's not "he" wanting to. He doesn't select the squad/team.

@brodean said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

Missed tackles on Saturday

5 @37.5% Damian Mckenzie
3 @66% Quinn Tuapaea
3 @72% Xavier Numia
2 @81% Jordie Barrett
2 @71% Peter Lakai
2 @89% Sam Darry
1 @75% Caleb Clarke

Of all the guys you could talk about who had poor defence on Saturday.

Quite surprised only 3 for QT - felt like he missed about that many in one movement down the sideline.

For all the focus on tackling, he played a crucial role in at least a couple of tries with sweet hands, timing and positioning. That tip on to open up space off the ball from Darry was superb.

There were a few niggles picked up on Saturday night for the ABs. Nothing serious but anyone carrying a niggle that could be made worse by playing will not be playing this week.

I don’t have names of those with niggles.

No mention of Tana anywhere in the thread? Not sure how much time he has had to make a difference or how big his role is but lets hope he can help stem the tide of points scored against the ABs in recent years.

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

@pakman said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

@Victor-Meldrew I expect three or four. BB to get a start at 15.

Minimal changes 9-12. Ditto 15. Think they should give Love and DMac more time together as well. Proctor at 13. - and give QT game time at 12.

I'd like to see Tupaea get a run at 12, but need to start Roigard/Love/Jordie as much as possible.

@chimoaus said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

No mention of Tana anywhere in the thread? Not sure how much time he has had to make a difference or how big his role is but lets hope he can help stem the tide of points scored against the ABs in recent years.

He has copped it a bit but I think it’s a little unfair. He has had just over a week to work with the squad. From what I heard, the main focus in the first week or so was on attack. More time went into that than defense.

Let’s give him some time to get his systems in place and make adjustments where needed.

@ShaquilleOatmeal said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

@Tim said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

Start the Hurricanes front row with Tosi starting or on bench. Vaai replaces Lord. Taukei'aho on the bench. Segner on the bench. Might need to manage Savea's minutes, so 6-2 split?

Wouldn't be surprised if Clarke picked up an injury before being subbed against France.

Think we'll see minimal changes in the starting XV. But maybe quite a few on the bench. Preston in for Ratima.

Who captains if RD is subbed? Jordie?

I don't disagree with having Preston ahead of Ratima in the pecking order but what's the point in dropping Ratima after playing just five minutes?

Italy are probably an easier proposition and better opportunity to see how Preston goes under the new regime. Halfback depth is a worry so need to test options.

Yeah, the Ratima thing was a bit weird. Can see why Rennie left Roigard on as the game was tight, but why sub him at 76 minutes?

@Landers92 said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

There were a few niggles picked up on Saturday night for the ABs. Nothing serious but anyone carrying a niggle that could be made worse by playing will not be playing this week.

I don’t have names of those with niggles.

Well that's Todd Blackadder out then.

@Landers92 and some of the misses were poor attempts at tackles more than a pattern or alignment issue.

Were.some great patches of good d while also some not good ones...

Is the French side known for thier D?

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

@Landers92 said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

There were a few niggles picked up on Saturday night for the ABs. Nothing serious but anyone carrying a niggle that could be made worse by playing will not be playing this week.

I don’t have names of those with niggles.

Well that's Todd Blackadder out then.

He was a limited player at test level in 2000, I'm not sure he's in the running 26 years later.

@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

Given coaches have made noises about everyone getting a run i would expect a fair few changes noting too that Italy lost to Japan on the week

I think so too.

Guys like Beaudy and ALB - and even Bower and Takeiáho - don't necessarily need a run, because we know what they have to offer - but, if the newbies are to get a test anytime soon, then this is the one to give them.

I'd expect all of Segner, Moorby, Fehi and Numia to be somewhere in the 23.

Despite the above, I reckon we'll also see Takei'aho and possibly Bower playing, because we don't need to see more from EDG and especially Taylor - though EDG could do with matchplay.

I think something like:
EDG, Aumua, Lomax
Darry, Lord
Lakai, Segner, Savea
Ratima, Love
Barrett, Proctor
Fineanganofo, Moorby, Jordan

Takei'aho, Numia, Tosi
Hannah/Patrick, Sititi
Preston, DMac, Tupaea

They'll probably also be looking at workloads of the Canes and Chiefs stalwarts, but also aware that there's time off after Ireland.

@Bovidae said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

Clarke looked lost on defence.

Not in the 23 this week

@Chris-B. said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

Given coaches have made noises about everyone getting a run i would expect a fair few changes noting too that Italy lost to Japan on the week

I think so too.

Guys like Beaudy and ALB - and even Bower and Takeiáho - don't necessarily need a run, because we know what they have to offer - but, if the newbies are to get a test anytime soon, then this is the one to give them.

I'd expect all of Segner, Moorby, Fehi and Numia to be somewhere in the 23.

Despite the above, I reckon we'll also see Takei'aho and possibly Bower playing, because we don't need to see more from EDG and especially Taylor - though EDG could do with matchplay.

I think something like:
EDG, Aumua, Lomax
Darry, Lord
Lakai, Segner, Savea
Ratima, Love
Barrett, Proctor
Fineanganofo, Moorby, Jordan

Takei'aho, Numia, Tosi
Hannah/Patrick, Sititi
Preston, DMac, Tupaea

They'll probably also be looking at workloads of the Canes and Chiefs stalwarts, but also aware that there's time off after Ireland.

I'd keep Jordan away from 15. Weapon on the wing, so-so at FB.

@Victor-Meldrew We will have to disagree on Jordan - but, he needs matchplay and DMac doesn't, so I think they'll probably go this way.

BB may be on the bench instead of DMac.

@Chris-B. said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

@Victor-Meldrew We will have to disagree on Jordan - but, he needs matchplay and DMac doesn't, so I think they'll probably go this way.

BB may be on the bench instead of DMac.

To carry on from my post above. Clarke out. Jordan remains on the wing and Dmac in 15.

@Landers92 said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

@chimoaus said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

No mention of Tana anywhere in the thread? Not sure how much time he has had to make a difference or how big his role is but lets hope he can help stem the tide of points scored against the ABs in recent years.

He has copped it a bit but I think it’s a little unfair. He has had just over a week to work with the squad. From what I heard, the main focus in the first week or so was on attack. More time went into that than defense.

Let’s give him some time to get his systems in place and make adjustments where needed.

No. I already have my favourite pitchfork.

@Landers92 said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

Clarke out.

Injured?

@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v Italy, 2026:

Is the French side known for thier D?

I think Shaun Edwards has now left so they have a new defence coach. But France were leaking points at the end of the 6N.