2025 All Blacks v France series

@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@Canes4life

Using your example, Ma'a Nonu was dropped a few times and yeah I was unhappy about each of those and argued against them on here at the time if I remember correctly.

But each time he got dropped, he came back stronger and more professional. It was interesting reading the other day Ben White (half back for Toulon, Scotland and the British and Irish Lions) say that he's never encountered a more professional Rugby player than Ma'a Nonu.

That's what the brutal All Blacks environment produces. Skilled athletes who are craftsmen.

Not really. He was given multiple opportunities and dropped multiple times. He was tried at centre and on the wing by multiple AB coaches. Didn’t make the 05 Lions squad after making the ABs in 03 and even starting against the best team in the world at the time. Was dropped for the 07 RWC after featuring in 06.

He eventually became an AB great. Some players just need to be persisted with over longer periods.

@ACT-Crusader said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@Canes4life

Using your example, Ma'a Nonu was dropped a few times and yeah I was unhappy about each of those and argued against them on here at the time if I remember correctly.

But each time he got dropped, he came back stronger and more professional. It was interesting reading the other day Ben White (half back for Toulon, Scotland and the British and Irish Lions) say that he's never encountered a more professional Rugby player than Ma'a Nonu.

That's what the brutal All Blacks environment produces. Skilled athletes who are craftsmen.

Not really. He was given multiple opportunities and dropped multiple times. He was tried at centre and on the wing by multiple AB coaches. Didn’t make the 05 Lions squad after making the ABs in 03 and even starting against the best team in the world at the time. Was dropped for the 07 RWC after featuring in 06.

He eventually became an AB great. Some players just need to be persisted with over longer periods.

I always knew he was special.....

@canefan said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@ACT-Crusader said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@Canes4life

Using your example, Ma'a Nonu was dropped a few times and yeah I was unhappy about each of those and argued against them on here at the time if I remember correctly.

But each time he got dropped, he came back stronger and more professional. It was interesting reading the other day Ben White (half back for Toulon, Scotland and the British and Irish Lions) say that he's never encountered a more professional Rugby player than Ma'a Nonu.

That's what the brutal All Blacks environment produces. Skilled athletes who are craftsmen.

Not really. He was given multiple opportunities and dropped multiple times. He was tried at centre and on the wing by multiple AB coaches. Didn’t make the 05 Lions squad after making the ABs in 03 and even starting against the best team in the world at the time. Was dropped for the 07 RWC after featuring in 06.

He eventually became an AB great. Some players just need to be persisted with over longer periods.

I always knew he was special.....

Once he ditched the hoodie I knew he would be an AB great…..

Heard France could be making a lot of changes to the team. One french reporter said as many as 10 changes. Hard to believe

@tomk said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

Heard France could be making a lot of changes to the team. One french reporter said as many as 10 changes. Hard to believe

France D?!

@ACT-Crusader said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@canefan said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@ACT-Crusader said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@Canes4life

Using your example, Ma'a Nonu was dropped a few times and yeah I was unhappy about each of those and argued against them on here at the time if I remember correctly.

But each time he got dropped, he came back stronger and more professional. It was interesting reading the other day Ben White (half back for Toulon, Scotland and the British and Irish Lions) say that he's never encountered a more professional Rugby player than Ma'a Nonu.

That's what the brutal All Blacks environment produces. Skilled athletes who are craftsmen.

Not really. He was given multiple opportunities and dropped multiple times. He was tried at centre and on the wing by multiple AB coaches. Didn’t make the 05 Lions squad after making the ABs in 03 and even starting against the best team in the world at the time. Was dropped for the 07 RWC after featuring in 06.

He eventually became an AB great. Some players just need to be persisted with over longer periods.

I always knew he was special.....

Once he ditched the hoodie I knew he would be an AB great…..

@ACT-Crusader said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@canefan said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@ACT-Crusader said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@Canes4life

Using your example, Ma'a Nonu was dropped a few times and yeah I was unhappy about each of those and argued against them on here at the time if I remember correctly.

But each time he got dropped, he came back stronger and more professional. It was interesting reading the other day Ben White (half back for Toulon, Scotland and the British and Irish Lions) say that he's never encountered a more professional Rugby player than Ma'a Nonu.

That's what the brutal All Blacks environment produces. Skilled athletes who are craftsmen.

Not really. He was given multiple opportunities and dropped multiple times. He was tried at centre and on the wing by multiple AB coaches. Didn’t make the 05 Lions squad after making the ABs in 03 and even starting against the best team in the world at the time. Was dropped for the 07 RWC after featuring in 06.

He eventually became an AB great. Some players just need to be persisted with over longer periods.

I always knew he was special.....

Once he ditched the hoodie I knew he would be an AB great…..

Fake news. Saw him at the pools just a couple of years back with a hoodie.

Hoodies are awesome and so is Nonu.

@tomk said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

Heard France could be making a lot of changes to the team. One french reporter said as many as 10 changes. Hard to believe

So their game plan is to ensure the All Blacks coaches scouting reports on last week's test match is futile..... Wheres the All blacks are a known quantity to France.

I can kind of understand what they are doing in that their approach takes all the pressure off them.

Wild stat - the test in Dunedin last weekend was Cam Roigard's first test match in NZ despite having played 10 test matches before that.

Hi guys...new here.

@Omega said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

Hi guys...new here.

Hi Omega, do you think Riley Higgins should be in the All Blacks squad?

Mr Fish...are you fishing??? No

Leroy Carter was the unlucky one.

@Mr-Fish a solid super rugby player but not test material...

I like the Sullivan brothers as well...maybe eoyt...building some dept.

@ACT-Crusader, I agre re Nonu, but also,

@ACT-Crusader said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

Some players just need to be persisted with over longer periods.

There been a few that have buggered off early because they perceive their way is blocked.

@nonpartizan said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@tomk said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

Heard France could be making a lot of changes to the team. One french reporter said as many as 10 changes. Hard to believe

So their game plan is to ensure the All Blacks coaches scouting reports on last week's test match is futile..... Wheres the All blacks are a known quantity to France.

I can kind of understand what they are doing in that their approach takes all the pressure off them.

I heard there are a grand total of 72 caps in this French squad.

I dont care what they are doing - it is incredibly disrespectful to do this. France vs All Blacks is an iconic fixture i. Rugby and they have turned it into a joke.

I really hope that we spank them by 50
Points in the next two tests and tell them don’t darken our door again

@DaGrubster said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@nonpartizan said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@tomk said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

Heard France could be making a lot of changes to the team. One french reporter said as many as 10 changes. Hard to believe

So their game plan is to ensure the All Blacks coaches scouting reports on last week's test match is futile..... Wheres the All blacks are a known quantity to France.

I can kind of understand what they are doing in that their approach takes all the pressure off them.

I heard there are a grand total of 72 caps in this French squad.

I dont care what they are doing - it is incredibly disrespectful to do this. France vs All Blacks is an iconic fixture i. Rugby and they have turned it into a joke.

I really hope that we spank them by 50
Points in the next two tests and tell them don’t darken our door again

Trust me, I don't disagree with you at all.

What it does is not only undermine the fixture and test rugby at large it puts them in a no loss position of they either excuse the loss as it wasnt our best side or they crow about their second string winning.

Their approach takes all the pressure off them but it's unsportsmanlike. I believe the term would be it's not cricket.

And it allows them to develop depth while devaluing test rugby. It doesn't help that we then can't pump them the way they deserve

@canefan said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

And it allows them to develop depth while devaluing test rugby. It doesn't help that we then can't pump them the way they deserve

This makes zero sense.

Grrrr how dare they develop depth with these uncapped players! Grrr how dare those inexperienced players be too good for us to beat by more!

@canefan said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

And it allows them to develop depth while devaluing test rugby. It doesn't help that we then can't pump them the way they deserve

But doesn't it speak volumes about the levels of NZ & French Rugby that we struggle to put away a French development team?

@Victor-Meldrew can remember when full strength All Black teams touring France use to struggle to put away French Divisional teams during the 80s and 90s ..
France have always had depth but issues in and around coaching and selection

These days the have 30 professional clubs including aligned academy’s
Money also trumps anything we see down here in NZ

@Steven-Harris said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@Victor-Meldrew can remember when full strength All Black teams touring France use to struggle to put away French Divisional teams during the 80s and 90s ..
France have always had depth but issues in and around coaching and selection

These days the have 30 professional clubs including aligned academy’s
Money also trumps anything we see down here in NZ

They are also strategically recruiting big talented kids from Aussie and NZ too. The French systems are pretty impressive!

@Steven-Harris said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@Victor-Meldrew can remember when full strength All Black teams touring France use to struggle to put away French Divisional teams during the 80s and 90s ..
France have always had depth but issues in and around coaching and selection

These days the have 30 professional clubs including aligned academy’s
Money also trumps anything we see down here in NZ

It isn't just money though. The FFR seems to have an actual plan.

@Victor-Meldrew no question but you must also remember throw 560,000 registered rugby players across 6 divisions a strong economy unlike NZ that has an economy that’s less than ideal at a time when young men working need to put food on the table or look at other options

Basketball is one of the faster growing sports in NZ taking many tall athletes off in a different direction ,also Rugby League with the popular NRL right on our doorstep with increased salaries that better anything the rugby in NZ offers under All Black level will also drag many promising rugby players to the 13 man game

Rugby at grassroots level is on life support at the minute

@Steven-Harris said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

Basketball is one of the faster growing sports in NZ taking many tall athletes off in a different direction ,also Rugby League with the popular NRL right on our doorstep

I've been hearing that for about 30 years...

@Steven-Harris

Reading Foster's book on @His-Bobness recommendation. Deserves a thread of its' own, but it's an indictment of NZR and it's lack of competence, in-fighting and putting commercial interests above the game.

@Bones said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@Steven-Harris said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

Basketball is one of the faster growing sports in NZ taking many tall athletes off in a different direction ,also Rugby League with the popular NRL right on our doorstep

I've been hearing that for about 30 years...

Luckily there is a really good system bringing absolute units in from old Zealand

Btw, the weird thing about the French approach to this series is how do you explain to the players who acquited themselves well in Dunedin why they were left out for the second test. Dropping 10 players from the first test makes absolutely no sense from a team building point of view.

Players want to play and they want to win, I'm just not sure how you sell players on being part of a project that is pretty incoherent.

@nonpartizan devil's advocate being you're selecting a lot of young players and they all know they're going to get a taste (as well as giving them a wage boost and locking them in).

Would love to see Love get a go at 10 next week. Nothing to lose really given Beauden's game tonight and with Roigard's kicking game quite low risk.

@Steven-Harris said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

Money also trumps anything we see down here in NZ

It's true but one thing NZ has that no other country can match is heritage, tradition and pride in the jersey.

To me the respective approaches to this series speak to how New Zealand have something that the French will never be able to buy or throw money at.

The word I would use is integrity.

@Victor-Meldrew said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@canefan said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

And it allows them to develop depth while devaluing test rugby. It doesn't help that we then can't pump them the way they deserve

But doesn't it speak volumes about the levels of NZ & French Rugby that we struggle to put away a French development team?

Thats the point I was trying to make, poorly in hindsight

Vaa'i did well for his try. He's probably deceptively fast but he definitely runs like a lock and not a loose forward.

Him at 6 is working well for the ABs. He went a bit better this week. Maybe PT in at lock helped with that.

@brodean said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

Vaa'i did well for his try. He's probably deceptively fast but he definitely runs like a lock and not a loose forward.

Thought he did a pretty decent job of mimicking PSDT tonight.

@Bones said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

@brodean said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:

Vaa'i did well for his try. He's probably deceptively fast but he definitely runs like a lock and not a loose forward.

Thought he did a pretty decent job of mimicking PSDT tonight.

That's high praise. He's coming along nicely. Need to see how he goes against a top 3 A team. He should get a chance soon against the Saffas.

@brodean just the rangy hitting of lines/rucks/tackles was a bit of a reminder.

Hoping it isn’t mass changes next week, as I’d like to see guys fill some roles…

1. de Groot
2. Taukei’aho
3. Newell (Lomax)
4. Vaa’i
5. Holland
6. Jacobson
7. Kirifi
8. Savea
9. Roigard
10. Love
11. Ioane
12. Tupaea
13. Proctor
14. Narawa
15. Jordan
16. McAllister
17. Norris
18. Tosi
19. Tuipulotu
20. Finau
21. Hotham
22. Tavatavanawai
23. McKenzie

When bigger tests roll around, I still think Tuipulotu would be best used as your impact man - Scott Barrett will rise to the challenge. Finau gets one last chance, and possibly edging to that territory for Kirifi so I’d start him to get a proper read.

PT runs a better lineout than Barrett and is a better lineout jumper.

PT better on the carry and Barrett better at the breakdown.

@brodean hopefully another good run next week and good leadership from Ardie and the heat will be on Scott.

@frugby I think it would be pretty unfair to give Kirifi his one start amongst a fairly small back 5 overall. At the very least swap Finau with Jacobson, or just have the same 4/5/6 as this week.