@pakman said in England Vs All Blacks:

Will the Fern melt down if ALB goes well?!

I'd be stoked. He's better than people think - like Rieko it's easy to pile on.

That said, I don't think I'd be picking him at the moment...

The issue for me with ALB ,you can hardly say he’s played his way into a starting XV not to mention his ability to pick up a card ..An average selection imo based on recent form can recall him being outplayed by Faletoi Peni during the Bunnings NPC

Well I am pumped for this one, we win this and the grand slam is all but ours - that's no mean feat. And I am finally excited about our bench again, I am fine with Parker starting and grinding them down for 50 minutes to allow us to unleash a fresh and in form Wallace for the last 30 minutes. I think that's a very good 1 - 2 punch.

I don't really know what to expect from England, other than I expect them to be seriously determined to get the W after so many close defeats to us in the last few years. What I am hoping is they come out all guns blazing, we weather the storm, and then we finish all over them with our bench forwards wrecking havoc against tired legs.

A big point of interest is how SBarrett goes. His work in the tight is going to be crucial to weathering that initial storm. I really hope he finds form again, he has shown glimpses, and he does so much work for us in that space that it allows our ball running loosies to have a much bigger impact on the match.

Just win. They are pricks to lose to!

@MN5 said in England Vs All Blacks:

@kiwiinmelb said in England Vs All Blacks:

@MN5 said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Landers92 said in England Vs All Blacks:

@MN5 yes, still a pinch. Just passing on the reasoning.

Yeah but they have three guys who can cover 12 in Tupea, LF and Ardie. I'd prefer Ioane there to cover centre and wing with that added dynamism that ALB lacks.

Sititi covers 13 as well , best distributor in open space in the team

You certainly wouldn't see Rassie wasting a spot with the likes of ALB.

Rassie did select Edwill Van Der Merwe though, who many knew has defensive flaws and was exposed by the Wallabies at Ellis Park….

@No-Quarter I just hope Scooter gets through the game uninjured.

Predictions for the match

• ABs by 9 with penalty kicks being a key part of the game
• two YCs (one each team)
• Lakai to top the tackle count
• Breakdown to be a mess (this Italian ref is as much a lottery as our Georgian friend)
• Will Jordan, QT and Codie Taylor with tries

Hopefully Codie Taylor has one more big game in him for the year

I got the sense last week he was starting to run on fumes.

@Jet said in England Vs All Blacks:

@brodean said in England Vs All Blacks:

@restofit said in England Vs All Blacks:

@DaGrubster said in England Vs All Blacks:

CLW, Josh Beehre and Caleb Tangitau added to the squad as training cover.

Finau and Jacobsen are heading home

Clarke, Jordan, Tangitau - the back 3 for 2027 World Cup?

It sounds exciting but I honestly don't see us winning an RWC with Jordan at 15.

We need someone at fullback with a better aerial game, a better boot, and a better play making ability.

11. Clarke
12. Leicester
13. Tupea
14. Jordan
15. Jordie

Agree with R Ioane and DMac on the bench.

This weekend All Black supporters should be sweating on the fact J Barrett is out and the massive hole this leaves defensively at the back and the weakness it opens up under the high ball. This is not really occurring because it is the status quo for the All Blacks and we are always vulnerable at the back now so why bother continually talking about it.

@game_film said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Bovidae Leinster must be wishing they’d signed Proctor instead.

Why? He's hasn't been a star performer for the ABs this season and has less name brand recognition than Ioane.

The oddest feeling about seeing this team is that even when I'm not happy with a team I'm confident we're going to win. I looked at this, which isn't much different than a lot our teams this year (when I've been confident we're going to win) and I instantly thought we're gonna lose this one. Hopefully my pessimism is hugely misplaced.

Lee Germon Barrett is due a big game, hopefully this is it.

@Mauss Entirely on the money in my view, as well - though, I watch a lot less of non AB tests, so can't really speak authoritatively about that trend - but, from what I've seen the high ball creates chaos - and teams have got to work out how - on balance - to be beneficiaries rather than victims of the chaos.

I think the Boks have a headstart because they've probably got the strongest scrum in world rugby. It was disturbing to me to see how badly they took our scrum apart - I haven't seen anyone else manage that, but I was also surprised how well the Scots stood up last weekend.

But, back to the Boks - their scrum gives a significant advantage where any ball is knocked on. And I think it encourages their contesters to be more disruptive - as compared to our guys who still very much look like they're mainly trying to catch the ball - which looks cool when it comes off, but might be a lower percentage option. But, also I suspect we're more inclined than most to use the ball in hand in offensive areas - rather than box kick - and on defense we're often kicking for touch rather than to contest.

Another chance to be a broken record about our idiotic media

"The 25 year old's return sees Wallace Sititi demoted to the bench"

Sititi has NOT been demoted. Repeat, NOT demoted, he has been put on the bench because he is an absolute fucking weapon for us at the back end of the game. You know, the part of the game where matches are won and lost? If he had been DEMOTED as this absurd article suggests, we wouldn't be fucking trusting him with winning us the game at the end would we!!

Jesus H Christ when will these idiots learn that modern rugby is a 23 man game?!?

TSF is essentially an island of rugby reason in a sea of idiots

@No-Quarter said in England Vs All Blacks:

Another chance to be a broken record about out idiotic media

View embedded content

"The 25 year old's return sees Wallace Sititi demoted to the bench"

Sititi has NOT been demoted. Repeat, NOT demoted, he has been put on the bench because he is an absolute fucking weapon for us at the back end of the game. You know, the part of the game where matches are won and lost? If he had been DEMOTED as this absurd article suggests, we wouldn't be fucking trusting him with winning us the game at the end would we!!

Jesus H Christ when will these idiots learn that modern rugby is a 23 man game?!?

The week after a bench player got man of the match and essentially was the match winner.

Most of them wanted Mackenzie promoted to start as a result. Same reason Beauden and Ardie have been shoehorned into the starting 15, unbalancing it for years when they were the two best bench/impact players in the world.

@No-Quarter the media love a victim or scapegoat and using emotive language even if it is way off what is reality.

Given Sititi has been used in this role during the year, it shouldn’t be a surprise to see him again off the bench.

I guess if it goes pear shape with Parker this journo has already written his post game article….

@Nepia said in England Vs All Blacks:

The oddest feeling about seeing this team is that even when I'm not happy with a team I'm confident we're going to win. I looked at this, which isn't much different than a lot our teams this year (when I've been confident we're going to win) and I instantly thought we're gonna lose this one. Hopefully my pessimism is hugely misplaced.

England at Twickenham is rarely easy. I think this was always likely to be the trickiest assignment on this tour, given we played the Irish on neutral territory.

Looking at the injury ward: Clarke, (the forgotten) Narawa, JBarrett, Hotham, Tuipolotu, Vaa'i, Aumua and Lomax.

Most of these guys would have played a role in this game - plus a few others like Norris and 2TVs probably a bit less likely.

@No-Quarter said in England Vs All Blacks:

Another chance to be a broken record about out idiotic media

View embedded content

"The 25 year old's return sees Wallace Sititi demoted to the bench"

Sititi has NOT been demoted. Repeat, NOT demoted, he has been put on the bench because he is an absolute fucking weapon for us at the back end of the game. You know, the part of the game where matches are won and lost? If he had been DEMOTED as this absurd article suggests, we wouldn't be fucking trusting him with winning us the game at the end would we!!

Jesus H Christ when will these idiots learn that modern rugby is a 23 man game?!?

Yup, we’ve (Ferners) realised it, the smart teams have realised it and one of the trends of 2025 is that it is creeping into mainstream/casual fan rugby thinking. Looks like Stuff journalists are missing the trend!

FFS Borthwick is deliberately putting 4 of his better players on the bench for the last 20 mins. Players who are highly probable to be better than their starting equivalents. SAF has been playing around with the optimal bench composition for years – and they have the requisite squad buy-in to do it.

@Chris-B yeah that's right everyones favorite Ta$man player TT would've been ideal for the bench this weekend had he not been injured, he would've gave Henry a right lesson

@MN5 said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Landers92 said in England Vs All Blacks:

@MN5 yes, still a pinch. Just passing on the reasoning.

Yeah but they have three guys who can cover 12 in Tupea, LF and Ardie. I'd prefer Ioane there to cover centre and wing with that added dynamism that ALB lacks.

Yeah for sure, I’m not defending it, just simply stating why he’s there. It makes me wonder if Big Jim was healthy, would he be on the bench in a situation like this.

@Landers92 said in England Vs All Blacks:

@MN5 said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Landers92 said in England Vs All Blacks:

@MN5 yes, still a pinch. Just passing on the reasoning.

Yeah but they have three guys who can cover 12 in Tupea, LF and Ardie. I'd prefer Ioane there to cover centre and wing with that added dynamism that ALB lacks.

Yeah for sure, I’m not defending it, just simply stating why he’s there. It makes me wonder if Big Jim was healthy, would he be on the bench in a situation like this.

No doubt about it with Jordie out.

@Chris-B if all fit I think what these coaches would go with

9- Cam
10- Beaudie
11- Clarke
12- Jordie
13- QT
14- Narawa
15- Jordan

21- Hotham 22- LF 23- DMac

@ACT-Crusader Pretty much spot on, I'd say!

Some interesting comments by McCaw. Like what he says about being ready to play and him not liking the concept of 'developing as an All Black'. Example: Holland ready to go. Parker developing.

@brodean ok, but who's ready to go in our"problem" positions? How do you know until you try a player? If they don't perform from the get go, do they get dropped?

We would have cast aside quite a few players, even in McCaw's day.

@Bones said in England Vs All Blacks:

@brodean ok, but who's ready to go in our"problem" positions? How do you know until you try a player? If they don't perform from the get go, do they get dropped?

We would have cast aside quite a few players, even in McCaw's day.

Which are the problem positions?

@Bones that Nonu guy is a prime example of a player that took time to develop, he ended up a handy player.

@taniwharugby said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Bones that Nonu guy is a prime example of a player that took time to develop, he ended up a handy player.

To be fair, both him and Kaino were cast aside!

@brodean said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Bones said in England Vs All Blacks:

@brodean ok, but who's ready to go in our"problem" positions? How do you know until you try a player? If they don't perform from the get go, do they get dropped?

We would have cast aside quite a few players, even in McCaw's day.

Which are the problem positions?

Is there someone ready to go at 6? Yes please.

@W32 said in England Vs All Blacks:

I watched the full 2019 semi final between these two teams for the first time. That was an incredible performance by England. Hoping for something similar this weekend. Cant wait

I will re-iterate several other comments - yeah, fuck you.
I was at that game, and it hurt.
I literally went out of my way to try and get beaten up by Japanese youths, and failed at even that.
Apologies for taking this personally, but... bad memories. Bad.

I would say - "Nah, seriously, good luck", but - nope.

@Nepia said in England Vs All Blacks:

The oddest feeling about seeing this team is that even when I'm not happy with a team I'm confident we're going to win. I looked at this, which isn't much different than a lot our teams this year (when I've been confident we're going to win) and I instantly thought we're gonna lose this one. Hopefully my pessimism is hugely misplaced.

Lee Germon Barrett is due a big game, hopefully this is it.

Touchstone game for me. We seem to go to shit every now and then and this game is the chance to move on from that.

Interested in how we handle the inevitable periods when we play badly and hope we cope as well as we did in the Irish and Scottish Tests

@Kruse said in England Vs All Blacks:

@W32 said in England Vs All Blacks:

I watched the full 2019 semi final between these two teams for the first time. That was an incredible performance by England. Hoping for something similar this weekend. Cant wait

I will re-iterate several other comments - yeah, fuck you.
I was at that game, and it hurt.
> I literally went out of my way to try and get beaten up by Japanese youths, and failed at even that.
Apologies for taking this personally, but... bad memories. Bad.

I would say - "Nah, seriously, good luck", but - nope.

Less easy to offend than people in Palmy ?

@Victor-Meldrew said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Nepia said in England Vs All Blacks:

The oddest feeling about seeing this team is that even when I'm not happy with a team I'm confident we're going to win. I looked at this, which isn't much different than a lot our teams this year (when I've been confident we're going to win) and I instantly thought we're gonna lose this one. Hopefully my pessimism is hugely misplaced.

Lee Germon Barrett is due a big game, hopefully this is it.

Touchstone game for me. We seem to go to shit every now and then and this game is the chance to move on from that.

Interested in how we handle the inevitable periods when we play badly and hope we cope as well as we did in the Irish and Scottish Tests

Same here. I see our tight 5 good enough. If the loosies handle this it's a step forward to the next WC.
Of course forwards are more important than backs.

@Nepia said in England Vs All Blacks:

I instantly thought we're gonna lose this one.

Yeah... I don't expect a win.
I've tried to explain to the seppos.. "I come from a place where I have a team I expect to win. 90% win-rate against anybody. Fuck y'all."
Don't have that any more. I'm kinda starting to understand how other people view sport. Don't particularly like it.

@Mauss said in England Vs All Blacks:

@pakman said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Mauss I should have clocked that from the Gary Stevenson reference!

I like him. Not so much as an economist per se. More as a sort of modern-day court jester. He’s like a character that’s jumped out of Brant’s Das Narrenschiff, a beautiful, bat-eared clown in these increasingly feudalistic times.

Brant’s *Das Narrenschiff == Ship of Fools?
With those sorts of high level references you're the Goff Whitlam equivalent of a modern rugby analyst. I just hope you're not Rocky 'Renaissance Man' Elsom!

@Kruse said in England Vs All Blacks:

Don't particularly like it.

Never change, Kruse. Sobriety is seriously over-rated.

@nostrildamus said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Mauss said in England Vs All Blacks:

@pakman said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Mauss I should have clocked that from the Gary Stevenson reference!

I like him. Not so much as an economist per se. More as a sort of modern-day court jester. He’s like a character that’s jumped out of Brant’s Das Narrenschiff, a beautiful, bat-eared clown in these increasingly feudalistic times.

Brant’s *Das Narrenschiff == Ship of Fools?
With those sorts of high level references you're the Goff Whitlam equivalent of a modern rugby analyst. I just hope you're not Rocky 'Renaissance Man' Elsom!

“The latest rugby analysis, now brought to you by the Service Pénitentiaire de Narbonne”?

I wish.

That backline looks as mediocre as an Italian WW2 infantry division. Having said that, such is the retardation of the present batch they will probably win handily. Sadly I don't really give a shit either way. And to think I used to break into a cold sweat if we beat Japan by 100 points but let in one try.

At least we have optimal bench impact with ALB there. Will have England quivering in fright when his pace, creativity and X factor are injected into the game.