Aussie Pro Rugby

@frugby said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

@KiwiMurph said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

@frugby said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

@KiwiMurph said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

@frugby said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

There is no Waratahs thread on here, but at what point do people start to question if maybe Dan McKellar isn't actually as good a coach as is always claimed?

The Tahs went 2 wins 12 losses last season and got the wooden spoon

The Tahs are 4 wins 3 losses at the moment

What were people expecting? I think Mckellar is doing just fine in year 1

Results have been decent, but the performances have been atrocious accounting for the talent in the squad.

Atrocious is harsh - they looked good in the home wins vs Force and Brumbies.

I think they really struggle at 9 and 10 if Gordon isn't at 9.

He is a pragmatic coach is Mckellar - The Brumbies were hardly the Harlem Globetrotters under his stewardship but they had good results.

Even before Gordon got injured they were disappointing…

Disagree. Year 1 of a new coach I wouldn't call them disappointing

@KiwiMurph said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

@frugby said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

@KiwiMurph said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

@frugby said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

@KiwiMurph said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

@frugby said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

There is no Waratahs thread on here, but at what point do people start to question if maybe Dan McKellar isn't actually as good a coach as is always claimed?

The Tahs went 2 wins 12 losses last season and got the wooden spoon

The Tahs are 4 wins 3 losses at the moment

What were people expecting? I think Mckellar is doing just fine in year 1

Results have been decent, but the performances have been atrocious accounting for the talent in the squad.

Atrocious is harsh - they looked good in the home wins vs Force and Brumbies.

I think they really struggle at 9 and 10 if Gordon isn't at 9.

He is a pragmatic coach is Mckellar - The Brumbies were hardly the Harlem Globetrotters under his stewardship but they had good results.

Even before Gordon got injured they were disappointing…

Disagree. Year 1 of a new coach I wouldn't call them disappointing

Scott Robertson, Dave Rennie, Vern Cotter all won in their first years in charge. Scott Laidlaw and Clayton McMillan have both come close in recent times. Don't think there's any reason why a team with a fairly stacked line-up (and not just a thrown together Highlanders-style one) and a good coach should be making excuses just because it's 'year one'.

@Mr-Fish said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

@KiwiMurph said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

@frugby said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

@KiwiMurph said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

@frugby said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

@KiwiMurph said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

@frugby said in Moana Pasifika v Waratahs:

There is no Waratahs thread on here, but at what point do people start to question if maybe Dan McKellar isn't actually as good a coach as is always claimed?

The Tahs went 2 wins 12 losses last season and got the wooden spoon

The Tahs are 4 wins 3 losses at the moment

What were people expecting? I think Mckellar is doing just fine in year 1

Results have been decent, but the performances have been atrocious accounting for the talent in the squad.

Atrocious is harsh - they looked good in the home wins vs Force and Brumbies.

I think they really struggle at 9 and 10 if Gordon isn't at 9.

He is a pragmatic coach is Mckellar - The Brumbies were hardly the Harlem Globetrotters under his stewardship but they had good results.

Even before Gordon got injured they were disappointing…

Disagree. Year 1 of a new coach I wouldn't call them disappointing

Scott Robertson, Dave Rennie, Vern Cotter all won in their first years in charge. Scott Laidlaw and Clayton McMillan have both come close in recent times. Don't think there's any reason why a team with a fairly stacked line-up (and not just a thrown together Highlanders-style one) and a good coach should be making excuses just because it's 'year one'.

I would disagree with the idea that the Waratahs are 'fairly stacked'. They have some big names but across the board stacked is not the word I would use. The Brumbies and Reds have better squads in Australia alone.

Of the Tahs big names - Tongan Thor is arguably the most overhyped rugby player on the planet, Jake Gordon is currently injured, Suaalii has missed most games due to a toe issue and Jorgensen is now out for months injured. Angus Bell has stayed fit this year which helps but there's not much left when you look at the rest of the players.

The Blues had the best squad in the comp last year and Dave Rennie had Aaron Cruden at 10 whilst Razor had Mo'unga at 10. They get credit for helping those young 10s flourish but it's night and day compared to Edmed and Creighton at 10.

@KiwiMurph My point was more that good coaches can take a good squad and see instant results - often teams outperform in their first year with a new coach, if anything.

Pleased for RA if they happy with that. Though seems a shame the one FTA game a week is gone, and would be very interesting to see what the performances that Wallabies and Super teams need to get full amount!

Loss of FTA will be decried as killing the game by all the nuffies who happily paid Foxtel a pound of flesh each month.

RA have made what looks like a gain here, but really it is starting from a low base so is probably about what the game is worth to any broadcaster at ~$40M per annum. Stan (the streaming platform) actually showed decent uptake for sport last time I looked.

Waugh is hoping that the Lions tour will help wipe out the debts and give him a platform to capitalise on the 2 x RWC we're hosting in 27 and 29.

There are so many variables though. New coach is one thing but a lot of player turnover too, as has been said.

I don't think this is a stacked team at all. Our depth is thin in key spots, and we don't have any locks. It's a good side on paper, sure, but missing finals won't be the end of the world considering.

Happy to stay with Stan. They put the effort in and the quality of the broadcast is way higher that it ever was with Fox/Kayo.

No FTA is a blow. I can understand why they made the trade-off, but it's annoying they had to make it. Stan Sport is pretty niche and not especially cheap, so you're losing a lot of casual eyeballs. Now they will still be there for the Wallabies so maybe it's no big loss.

the problem with Stan is its commercial option. By all accounts its super expensive, meaning there are very few pubs around who can put the rugby on.

@NTA said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

Loss of FTA will be decried as killing the game by all the nuffies who happily paid Foxtel a pound of flesh each month.

No doubt Nine are expecting some of them to migrate to Stan. Interesting if this was shared with RA.

RA have made what looks like a gain here, but really it is starting from a low base so is probably about what the game is worth to any broadcaster at ~$40M per annum. Stan (the streaming platform) actually showed decent uptake for sport last time I looked.

Waugh is hoping that the Lions tour will help wipe out the debts and give him a platform to capitalise on the 2 x RWC we're hosting in 27 and 29.

Assuming the same inflation applies from 2020-2024 through to 2030, the last year will be basically what $30million bought in 2020...

Depending on the amount WR hover up, the addition of a WRWC should be well supported here. Especially if the Wallaroos can be more competitive against everyone but England who will probably romp home.

Looks like it's going to be Les Kiss as the Wallabies coach

The Roar can reveal RA chief executive Phil Waugh and director of high performance Peter Horne flew to Brisbane to speak with Reds CEO David Hanham and general manager Sam Cordingley on Tuesday morning to discuss Kiss.

It’s understood that Kiss, who is contracted to coach the Queensland Reds through to the end of the 2026 Super Rugby season, wasn’t present in the meeting.

What was discussed remains closely guarded, but it’s believed the basis of the meeting was around how the 60-year-old can take over at the Wallabies later this year while also serving out the rest of his three-year deal with the Reds.

@KiwiMurph don't mind that. He'll have done a couple of years with the Reds as head coach as well as a range of supporting roles around the globe.

He's given the Reds a bit of steel, working on the foundation Thorn left of ejecting the dickheads.

Fuck me these Premier Rugby dickheads are delusional.

This was posted on their Facebook page.

"Key partner"?

I was impressed with Will Harrison when he played for the Waratahs but had rotten luck with injury.

If he was still at the Tahs I would've have had him as the starting 10.

Joe Schmidt will be staying a little longer before the transition to Les Kiss.

He's easily swayed to coach haha after many 'no more's and retirements! Great news for Oz and the Reds

Harry Wilson leaving Dragons in Wales and coming back to Aussie, could be a pick up for any team in 2026

@Trig said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

Harry Wilson leaving Dragons in Wales and coming back to Aussie, could be a pick up for any team in 2026

The current Reds captain?

@antipodean said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

@Trig said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

Harry Wilson leaving Dragons in Wales and coming back to Aussie, could be a pick up for any team in 2026

The current Reds captain?

Nah the other one - ex-Tahs Centre and brother of current Tahs halfback Teddy Wilson.

@NTA said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

@antipodean said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

@Trig said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

Harry Wilson leaving Dragons in Wales and coming back to Aussie, could be a pick up for any team in 2026

The current Reds captain?

Nah the other one - ex-Tahs Centre and brother of current Tahs halfback Teddy Wilson.

Ahh, David Wilson's kid?

@antipodean bingo.

Looks just like his brother, and both look just like the old man.

More media noise about Cleary possibly moving to rugby with a column in The Australian from league journalist and his biographer, Andrew Webster. I wasn't ware that it was time for contract negotiations, nor do I understand why Tim Horan and Meltdown Turinui are banging on about it. First he's not going to move. Second he's bang average. Third he's made of glass.

@antipodean said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

More media noise about Cleary possibly moving to rugby with a column in The Australian from league journalist and his biographer, Andrew Webster. I wasn't ware that it was time for contract negotiations, nor do I understand why Tim Horan and Meltdown Turinui are banging on about it. First he's not going to move. Second he's bang average. Third he's made of glass.

Definitely just a contract boosting tactic, didn't Cleary do the same thing last time his contract was up?

Nathan Cleary is contracted until the end of 2027 for $1.3m a season. Absolutely none of this is coming from him or his camp. This is australian rugby trying to get some form of cut-through in the media. It's a retarded story from any angle you want to look at it.

@mariner4life said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

Nathan Cleary is contracted until the end of 2027 for $1.3m a season. Absolutely none of this is coming from him or his camp. This is australian rugby trying to get some form of cut-through in the media. It's a retarded story from any angle you want to look at it.

Thanks, I didn't realise that he was already contracted for that long. Definitely not going to happen then, just another case of Aussie Rugby having egg on their face while trying to remain relevant with bogus headlines.

@antipodean said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

More media noise about Cleary possibly moving to rugby with a column in The Australian from league journalist and his biographer, Andrew Webster. I wasn't ware that it was time for contract negotiations, nor do I understand why Tim Horan and Meltdown Turinui are banging on about it. First he's not going to move. Second he's bang average. Third he's made of glass.

Cleary is "bang average"???

That's an odd take

Cleary is really fucking good but nowhere near as good as the media like to make out.

For instance, i firmly believe Mitch Moses to be a better player. But Mitch plays for the Eels, while Nathan got to come up with a generational Penrith side.

The only thing that would have me thinking about changing my mind was the 15 minutes of football Cleary produced to win a lost GF all by himself. That was fucking special and will be talked about for a long time.

@mariner4life said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

Cleary is really fucking good but nowhere near as good as the media like to make out.

For instance, i firmly believe Mitch Moses to be a better player. But Mitch plays for the Eels, while Nathan got to come up with a generational Penrith side.

The only thing that would have me thinking about changing my mind was the 15 minutes of football Cleary produced to win a lost GF all by himself. That was fucking special and will be talked about for a long time.

I don't watch nearly as much league as you guys - but I'll never forget that. Those 15mins were as special as anything I've seen on a rugby field in either code.

Kicking goals this year (Origin aside) at 93% ain't to be sneezed at either

Cleary does nearly everything to an incredibly high standard. An incredibly accurate kicking game, whether short or long, high or low, it almost always lands exactly where it needs to. It's a huge reason for Penrith's 4-peat. He passes accurately off both hands, and his running must be better than it looks for how often that right foot step of his pokes his nose through a hole. He's also a robust defender (he's a pretty big halfback). But he's not alone in having all of that among the elite NRL halves.

He has, until this year, also had a dream job. Penrith over their dominant period average a points-against of like 13. Imagine being an NRL half and knowing you only need to turn up an lay on 3 tries to win? And you are going to be getting an armchair ride behind the most aggressive and accurate pack in the comp? Through in Yeo playing first receiver to a ridiculously high level and Nathan has had advantages most halves can only dream of.

@voodoo said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

@antipodean said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

More media noise about Cleary possibly moving to rugby with a column in The Australian from league journalist and his biographer, Andrew Webster. I wasn't ware that it was time for contract negotiations, nor do I understand why Tim Horan and Meltdown Turinui are banging on about it. First he's not going to move. Second he's bang average. Third he's made of glass.

Cleary is "bang average"???

That's an odd take

I think in comparison to his peers it's a reasonable take. A generational squad, injured half the time so Penrith had to make finals with him in rehab.

To look at it another way; could the Panthers have achieved GF success by swapping him out for another player? I say yes.

I was going to weigh in on the Cleary debate but then I remembered that I never believed Metcalf would amount to anything other than a good runner at five eighth.

I don't think the speculation is that outrageous

There's a home Rugby World Cup in 2027

What else does he have left to achieve in League?

People get out of contracts all the time

@KiwiMurph said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

I don't think the speculation is that outrageous

There's a home Rugby World Cup in 2027

What else does he have left to achieve in League?

People get out of contracts all the time

Not long to get his head around that level of change - needs a lot of time at pro level if he's going to be a playmaker.

Did Cleary even play at school? Suali'i did which would have helped, but IMHO he still looks a little hesitant to position around rucks etc

Interesting I didn't realise the World Cup was in Manchester? Could he potentially go maybe for the World Cup with an eye on relocation second? Maybe just very unlikely

@NTA said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

@KiwiMurph said in Aussie Pro Rugby:

I don't think the speculation is that outrageous

There's a home Rugby World Cup in 2027

What else does he have left to achieve in League?

People get out of contracts all the time

Not long to get his head around that level of change - needs a lot of time at pro level if he's going to be a playmaker.

Did Cleary even play at school? Suali'i did which would have helped, but IMHO he still looks a little hesitant to position around rucks etc

Yes he would need to make the switch very soon. I guess the flip side is he'd probably back himself to make the squad - 10 isn't exactly a position of strength.

That's a move that can only help his career.