@Wurzel said in RIP Dan Vickerman:
It's not reported on so as not to inspire copycats. People - especially youth - read it and think it's a legitimate 'out' for issues they are battling.
Funny then its not reported in NZ yet we still have the highest suicide rate in the western world.
Something clearly has to change, burying our heads in the sand wont change a thing.
The copycat argument is bullshit
@Virgil said in RIP Dan Vickerman:
The copycat argument is bullshit
The NSW police used to explain how people met their ends in the gazette. They stopped doing that after a couple of people used the same novel technique. Including one who had clearly changed his mind, albeit a little too late.
@antipodean yea I read something a week or 2 back about 3 girls, made a pact to kill themselves, 1 did it, other 2 didnt, said they were never serious...
Seems to be alot of organisations trying to make people more aware of Suicide at the moment.
@Virgil A couple of years ago the media outlets in NZ got together and decided to report suicides, but that was only after the parents of one suicide victims asked media to report it. I think they now only report it if the family requests it, otherwise it's just the lifeline information at the end of the article.
What a tragic news. So young! Devastating for his wife and young sons! RIP.
I agree that the media shouldn't discuss suicide in detail, but that's no excuse for not discussing mental illness. In NZ, and probably also in Australia (?), we have this terrible "harden up mentality" that prevents people with mental illness talking about it, out of fear of being labelled soft or wacko. It's also one of the most under-diagnosed illnesses, maybe for that reason. What we see and hear are some of the consequences of mental illness: suicide, alcoholism, gambling, other addictions, which are then either bemoaned, deplored or condemned, but there's often no discussion about what may be causing it.
I'm starting to hate this year already .. already 3 rugby union stars gone. And that's only union.
@Sneakdefreak said in RIP Dan Vickerman:
@Virgil A couple of years ago the media outlets in NZ got together and decided to report suicides, but that was only after the parents of one suicide victims asked media to report it. I think they now only report it if the family requests it, otherwise it's just the lifeline information at the end of the article.
Jim Andertons daughter took her own life and he's used every ounce of influence he has to stop the press reporting on it ever since . Occasionally if the family requests it there will be stories about the background of victims, the last one I read was absolutely heartbreaking. I'm sure we all know of someone whos taken their own life and that feeling that there's something you might have been able to do to help even if it was only lending a sympathetic ear never really goes away.
Back to the OP , very sad news . He was the sort of player you wish was wearing your teams jersey every time he played against you.
In more positive news Christian Leilafanos leukaemia is apparently in remission and he wants to get back to playing asap.
@jegga said in RIP Dan Vickerman:
Jim Andertons daughter took her own life and he's used every ounce of influence he has to stop the press reporting on it ever since . Occasionally if the family requests it there will be stories about the background of victims, the last one I read was absolutely heartbreaking. I'm sure we all know of someone whos taken their own life and that feeling that there's something you might have been able to do to help even if it was only lending a sympathetic ear never really goes away.
It was the coverage of his daughter's mental health issues (before she killed herself) that he stopped the media reporting on and I support him for doing that. I know of journalists accidentally playing a part in the suicide of a mentally ill person because they wanted to report it for their news outlet.
What is the NZRU/ARU/Super Rugby policy on player wellbeing during and after their careers? I know the NRL has support groups for players who have fallen on hard times and really try and help the young players (after several suicides from young guys who buckled under the stress of professional sports and needing to provide for their families).
Not sure if you can get past the paywall but the Sunday Times (UK) has an article about mental health for rugby players which has come out with perfect (if sad) timing
Yes, it's from the Walrus
Terrible news 
My condolences, thoughts, hugs and love go to his family and friends.
I too believe the stigmatism around suicide needs to be brushed aside so we can talk openly about this tragic subject.
I like to believe that if people considering suicide could see the devastation suicide leaves behind, they'd maybe feel differently about it as an option.
@Virgil said in RIP Dan Vickerman:
@Wurzel said in RIP Dan Vickerman:
It's not reported on so as not to inspire copycats. People - especially youth - read it and think it's a legitimate 'out' for issues they are battling.
Funny then its not reported in NZ yet we still have the highest suicide rate in the western world.
Something clearly has to change, burying our heads in the sand wont change a thing.
The copycat argument is bullshit
I don't think we actually have the highest suicide rate in the western world. We may have the highest male youth maybe, but there's a number of western countries with a higher rate than us.
Sad to hear about - I wonder if there was any knowledge within the rugby community that he was struggling . RIP.
Whatever the cause of death, condolences to his family. If the speculation is correct, I hope that any learnings are captured 're identification of an issues, monitoring, and intervention. It can't be easy hanging up your boots after being a top level competitor, and depending on the individual I'd guess that pro sportsmen are potentially more vulnerable to depression. Shit, I felt bad enough when I stopped playing, and I did it as a hobby - must hit like a train when it's your life 24/7. I would also guess that with the pros now maybe lacking academic qualifications or existing careers like the older generations, whilst facing shorter more intense playing careers, this is an area that will need managing.
I'd think less so with Vickerman - by all reports he had a successful career post-rugby and was still involved in the game.
@Sneakdefreak said in RIP Dan Vickerman:
@jegga said in RIP Dan Vickerman:
Jim Andertons daughter took her own life and he's used every ounce of influence he has to stop the press reporting on it ever since . Occasionally if the family requests it there will be stories about the background of victims, the last one I read was absolutely heartbreaking. I'm sure we all know of someone whos taken their own life and that feeling that there's something you might have been able to do to help even if it was only lending a sympathetic ear never really goes away.
It was the coverage of his daughter's mental health issues (before she killed herself) that he stopped the media reporting on and I support him for doing that. I know of journalists accidentally playing a part in the suicide of a mentally ill person because they wanted to report it for their news outlet.
What is the NZRU/ARU/Super Rugby policy on player wellbeing during and after their careers? I know the NRL has support groups for players who have fallen on hard times and really try and help the young players (after several suicides from young guys who buckled under the stress of professional sports and needing to provide for their families).
Media can certainly leave out the how's and the whys of a suicide. But why can't they be allowed to use the 'S' word?
It's such a taboo subject it's easier to pretend it doesn't happen, but it does and far too often.
In recent weeks there's been news reports of kids as young as 8 taking their own life.. 8!
@NTA said in RIP Dan Vickerman:
I'd think less so with Vickerman - by all reports he had a successful career post-rugby and was still involved in the game.
He did take time out of the game to get edumicated. It's probably difficult when you're used to a level of success in one aspect of your life that may not translate into others.
@jegga said in RIP Dan Vickerman:
Back to the OP , very sad news . He was the sort of player you wish was wearing your teams jersey every time he played against you.
In more positive news Christian Leilafanos leukaemia is apparently in remission and he wants to get back to playing asap.
Tragic about Vickermann. What can you say about that. Wife and kids too. You have to think that this was a spur of the moment, lowest ebb kind of thing. Surely this is not something you'd do if you gave it alot of thought and considered the consequences? I don't know, it's just so damn sad.
But that CL news almost brought tears to my eyes. That is so farking wonderful. Fantastic.
It does seem like we may never know what took DV. And either way, it's a hell of a shit thing to happen, and an absolutely tragic situation.
But I can't help but think that it's not right to leave it undisclosed. I'm not saying that the public has a right to know, but what good does the keeping the information private do? I'm sitting here wondering, as I know many others are, and I've seen articles ending with lifeline numbers etc - which is suggesting suicide. But if that's the case, isn't it better to confirm it than simply have media speculating?
What if it was another condition then - and undiagnosed heart issue, or perhaps something else which could have been prevented. Is it not better to go public with this and then maybe just save another few earlier than taken lives as people are better prepared?
I'm not sure what my point of view is here of the finer details. Maybe more will come out in later days, maybe it won't. But I struggle see anything significant to the positive side for disclosing no information.
A few interesting articles about this I found via a Google search:
Basically the issues around reporting of suicides seem to revolve more around discussion of methods and details rather than a general reluctance to use the s-word.
I think there's a balance to be struck here, and I agree we're currently a bit too tentative to talk about it.
At very least we can include the fact that a person took their own life in reporting, though no-one needs to know any more details than that.
