Klitschko, Fury, Parker, Takam & Joshua

<p>Tyson was afar better boxer</p>
<p>Extreme head movement (Tua limited there although used shoulder roll defence quite well but by-in-large was hit way too much losing rounds relying on his granite head to wear opponents down.</p>
<p>Tyson's hand /upperbody and hip movement was freakish</p>
<p>Add that to knock out power in both hands and a large array of combinations  ( Tua again limited in punching combos)</p>
<p>In saying that its a fight that could go either way between the 2 although I think Mikes speed would take it.</p>
<p>Tyson lost alot of that movement and speed as he got older and not just because of prison- those reflect movements are only belonging to the youth once that goes fighters must change their game plans/styles- same thing happened to Ali when he got older- no way 60's early 70's Ali would rope a dope Foreman- he would beat him with footwork and hand speed as well as freakish ablility to dodge punches. alar Liston fight- Cleveland Williams</p>
<p>Look at Roy Jones Jr a reflects fighter still trying to continue ( a crime) he can no longer evade punches from journeyman and he takes them on the chin</p>

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Bart The Muss" data-cid="547608" data-time="1450070647">
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<p>Tyson was afar better boxer</p>
<p>Extreme head movement (Tua limited there although used shoulder roll defence quite well but by-in-large was hit way too much losing rounds relying on his granite head to wear opponents down.</p>
<p>Tyson's hand /upperbody and hip movement was freakish</p>
<p>Add that to knock out power in both hands and a large array of combinations  ( Tua again limited in punching combos)</p>
<p>In saying that its a fight that could go either way between the 2 although I think Mikes speed would take it.</p>
<p>Tyson lost alot of that movement and speed as he got older and not just because of prison- those reflect movements are only belonging to the youth once that goes fighters must change their game plans/styles- same thing happened to Ali when he got older- no way 60's early 70's Ali would rope a dope Foreman- he would beat him with footwork and hand speed as well as freakish ablility to dodge punches. alar Liston fight- Cleveland Williams</p>
<p>Look at Roy Jones Jr a reflects fighter still trying to continue ( a crime) he can no longer evade punches from journeyman and he takes them on the chin</p>
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<p>Yeah , Tyson had more tricks I reckon with his ducking and weaving , and had knock out power in both hands ,</p>
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<div>with Tua it was usually  about the lethal left hook ,  made him that bit more predictable ,  but what a hook it was all the same </div>
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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MN5" data-cid="547550" data-time="1450047527">
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<p>I don't reckon Parker is remotely in Tuas league in terms of power punching.</p>
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<p>Yeah , he is knocking guys out as a result of combinations , still effective though , </p>
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<p>But Tua would put them to sleep with one punch </p>

<p>yes Tua was more a 1 trick pony- or more he relied on the left hook to get him out of trouble... trouble for Tua was not getting hurt but falling behind by huge distances on pts, too many times he got away with ko in 9-10th round. Not knocking him for doing so but I think it may have hindered his progress as a boxer and he was happy just to be a puncher.</p>
<p>Tua did have a right hand that could hurt- ask former HW champ Micheal Moorer ( not the worlds best chin though)</p>
<p>Parker and Tua although both Samoan Kiwis are poles apart as boxers. Iloved watching Tua ko people back in the day but its JP's time now and I will watch and support him as much as possible, if I win Lotto and can retire I and go to his fights!</p>

<p>In case anyone, like me had forgotten - wincing alert </p>
<p> </p>
<p>

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Siam" data-cid="547634" data-time="1450110045">
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<p>In case anyone, like me had forgotten - wincing alert </p>
<p> </p>
<p>

Ouch - to paraphrase Crocop - right hook hospital, left hook cemetery.<br><br>
What marked out Tyson for me was his ability to keep throwing heavy shots, whatever body position he seemed to be in. Must have had the core of an ox, I think his relative lack of height was actually an advantage in this respect.

Similiar principle to Rocky Marciano who was around the same height. <br><br>
Fighting out of a bit of a crouch definitely aids hitting power and this is something Jim Jeffries and Jack Dempsey did despite being very tall for their eras ( 6 foot 2 and 6 foot respectively )

<p>No doubting Tua's power, pace & precision, but did he ever fight anyone who was any good?</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Could have been a contender in the early days of the UFC.</p>

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MiketheSnow" data-cid="547674" data-time="1450138480">
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<p>No doubting Tua's power, pace & precision, but did he ever fight anyone who was any good?</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Could have been a contender in the early days of the UFC.</p>
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<p>I'm no expert on the heavyweight division back then but I think John Ruiz, Michael Moorer and Hasim Rahman were all significant victories at the time.</p>

Rahman beat Lewis. Enough said. Tua was very, very good and a guy who everyone tried to avoid. Doubt he coulda got close, literally or figuratively, to the Klitchkos though....

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MiketheSnow" data-cid="547674" data-time="1450138480">
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<p>No doubting Tua's power, pace & precision, but did he ever fight anyone who was any good?</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Could have been a contender in the early days of the UFC.</p>
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<p>He was top 4 or thereabouts for quite some time , </p>
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<p>Probably a little mis managed , </p>
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<p>Fought Rahman , controversial draw, many thought he won , </p>
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<p>Fought Lewis for the world title and lost . </p>
<p> </p>
<p>Like has been mentioned by MN5 , the type of guy people didnt want to fight , possibly the best left hook heavyweight boxing has ever seen , his leading hand was his money punch . which made him unorthodox </p>

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Bart The Muss" data-cid="547617" data-time="1450085110">
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<p>yes Tua was more a 1 trick pony- or more he relied on the left hook to get him out of trouble... trouble for Tua was not getting hurt but falling behind by huge distances on pts, too many times he got away with ko in 9-10th round. Not knocking him for doing so but I think it may have hindered his progress as a boxer and he was happy just to be a puncher.</p>
<p>Tua did have a right hand that could hurt- ask former HW champ Micheal Moorer ( not the worlds best chin though)</p>
<p>Parker and Tua although both Samoan Kiwis are poles apart as boxers. Iloved watching Tua ko people back in the day but its JP's time now and I will watch and support him as much as possible, if I win Lotto and can retire I and go to his fights!</p>
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<p>Yeah - basically Tua was too short to be properly competitive in the elite heavyweight ranks. Lennox Lewis killed him - he was six inches taller, had a massive reach advantage, and was faster around the ring. Tua basically went into that fight as a puncher's chance - but, in most ways it was a mismatch. Lewis could just rack up points with his jab and Tua needed to land a big left hook to knock him out and win. Tyson - being a lot shorter than Lennox, would have been a better match for Tua but, in his prime, he had way to much firepower for Dave.  </p>
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<p>Baby Joseph looks like a different story to me. He's got the physique and he's certainly got some speed and plenty of power. Whether he can navigate the shithole that is pro boxing to a title is a different question, but it's promising that he's ranked highly by the WBO (?) get one title and then the fighters will come to him.</p>

According to stats Sonny Liston at 6 foot 1 had a reach of 2.13???? ( ie about 7 foot??? ) that's gotta be bullshit.

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MN5" data-cid="547731" data-time="1450160778">
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<p>According to stats Sonny Liston at 6 foot 1 had a reach of 2.13???? ( ie about 7 foot??? ) that's gotta be bullshit.</p>
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<p>Manute Bol was 7'7" with a 102" reach.</p>
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<p>yeh, my wingspan is 17cm longer than my height.. </p>

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Siam" data-cid="547634" data-time="1450110045">
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<p>In case anyone, like me had forgotten - wincing alert </p>
<p> </p>
<p>

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Chris B." data-cid="547730" data-time="1450160513">
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<p>Yeah - basically Tua was too short to be properly competitive in the elite heavyweight ranks. Lennox Lewis killed him - he was six inches taller, had a massive reach advantage, and was faster around the ring. Tua basically went into that fight as a puncher's chance - but, in most ways it was a mismatch. Lewis could just rack up points with his jab and Tua needed to land a big left hook to knock him out and win. Tyson - being a lot shorter than Lennox, would have been a better match for Tua but, in his prime, he had way to much firepower for Dave.  </p>
<p> </p>
<p>Baby Joseph looks like a different story to me. He's got the physique and he's certainly got some speed and plenty of power. Whether he can navigate the shithole that is pro boxing to a title is a different question, but it's promising that he's ranked highly by the WBO (?) get one title and then the fighters will come to him.</p>
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<p>From the outside looking in , apart from his physical attributes,  Joseph seems to have a better more professional attitude than Tua which im tipping will take him further </p>
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<p>Rumor has it Tua , despite his natural ability , was a lazy trainer and  had poor discipline with his diet </p>

<p>I think those diet rumours were there for all to see, especially in 2nd half of career where training camps were more like weight loss programes for middle-aged housewives- rather than boxing which showed. Tua would have a warm up fight v a bum take 2 years off bloat to obesity then rinse and repeat.</p>
<p>As far as boxing no one- hell he fought some major players on the way up ( seen as potential champs) watch the Ike can't spell last fight- broke heavyweight punching stat records, Ike flew cover the cuckoos nest after that fight and is still in prison, he was to be the next big thing.</p>

<p>Old Ike, had a lot of potential but was a bit fkn loose outside the ring that is for sure.</p>
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<p>Highlights of the fight</p>
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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Don Frye" data-cid="547736" data-time="1450161423"><p>Manute Bol was 7'7" with a 102" reach.<br>
 <br><a class="bbc_url" href="

<p>Just watched the Joshua vs Whyte bout and up until know I had been very impressed by Joshua. This fight though he was gassed early, showed a piss poor mindset by deciding to go all smash and bash instead of out boxing Whyte. He carried his hands really low and had his chin exposed for the world to see by a guy who doesn't really have classic heavyweight power.</p>
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<p>They talk about an eventual Parker fight on this side of the world but I think Parker would eat him up. No doubt there is serious power in Joshua's punches, his straight rights are fucking brutal, but I don't see the same level of speed and foot work that Parker has. He's very top heavy too, not a lot of strength in his legs.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Just my opinion..</p>

<p>He definitely skips leg day, looks comically out of proportion.</p>
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<p><img src="http://www.boxingnewsonline.net/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Anthony-Joshua.jpg" alt="Anthony-Joshua.jpg"></p>

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Razbra" data-cid="548094" data-time="1450361974">
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<p>They talk about an eventual Parker fight on this side of the world but I think Parker would eat him up.</p>
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<p>Jeepers. Big call.</p>
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<p>Do we know if Parker can take a punch? Because we now know that Joshua can.</p>
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<p>Joshua is an obvious world heavyweight in the waiting. Parker must be seriously good in that case. Exciting.</p>

<p>Personally I reckon Joshua is a wee bit ahead of Parker at this stage but so hard to tell. Would be great to see them match up but suspect it wont be for a little while yet</p>

<p>It is a big call. Its just about the movement I see from both fighters. Joshua is a more powerful puncher than Parker and I think he connects more accurately on his power punches. He tends to stand right in front of his opponent though. His hands are low and he is more likely to get hit on the way in. Joseph has better, not elite yet, but better head movement and better footwork to elude punches coming in.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Parker has the fastest hands in the division and I reckon if they fought Barry would have him play keep away and out manoeuvre/out point Joshua.</p>

<p>Power is a funny thing , guys with quick hands tend to have a lot of snap on their punches , they tend to be a lot harder than they look , </p>
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<p>If Parker hits you flush enough times he is going to hurt you , especially the right hand , </p>
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<p>My main concern is his defense and his chin , not that I think it is bad ,</p>
<p> </p>
<p>its more I havent seen them  tested yet , all his fights have been a walk in the park so far </p>

<p>I would rate Joshua ahead of Parker slightly at this stage - Joshua has only had 1 test so far Parker has had a couple that have been ok (Sherman, Kali) I just think Joshua has performed well under huge spotlight-pressure- in front of huge crowds etc.</p>
<p>Would love to see JP fight in UK or US on a big card to prepare him for the pressures that come with that</p>

Yeah the power thing is funny. Doesn't need to be said on here how fast Ali's hands were but what got guys was the relentlessness and unerring accuracy he brought to the table. In saying that I'm certain Liston took a dive.

Quite often the punch that knocks you out is the one you don't see coming <br><br>
with no warning it's like being King hit <br><br>
More likely to go to sleep like that than if you see it coming <br><br>
It's a similar thing in contact sports like rugby when you see the hit coming you brace yourself when you get blind sighted it hurts a lot more

Very true, if you brace yourself I don't think it necessarily hurts less but you're definitely more prepared.

Ali attributed his knock outs to hand sped over power <br><br>
When the brain doesn't register what is about to happen next , the surprise factor can be too much , particularly when already fatigued

True, he put Foreman down when other fine fighters couldn't. Evander Holyfield would have had more luck knocking over a brick wall.

<p>Looks like Deontay Wilder wants a piece of Fury as well.. </p>

<p>Better fight for Wilder than his mandatory Povetkin who may be too much for him</p>

<p>Ive got a feeling Fury is going to lose to Klitchko in the rematch and all this is short lived , </p>
<p> </p>
<p>Although I think Klitchko is at the end , I rate his best better than Furys best ,  if he has that one big one left in him </p>

<p>Inga Tuigamala's kid is fighting on the Parker undercard.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>He's 6'3", 117kg and 15 years old.</p>
<p>And he's fighting the 28 year old amateur heavyweight champion of Samoa.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Go kid.</p>
<p> </p>
<p> :lol:  :lol:  :lol:</p>
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<p><a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&amp;objectid=11577509'>http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&amp;objectid=11577509</a></p>

Aren't Inga and Tua cousins? Some good genes in that kid.

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Crazy Horse" data-cid="553728" data-time="1453360054"><p>
Aren't Inga and Tua cousins? Some good genes in that kid.</p></blockquote>
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Yeah, sounds familiar. Pretty sure they're related to the Anoa'i clan as well (pro wrestlers, Yokozuna, Rikishi, Usos, Roman Reigns to name a few of the more recent ones).<br><br>
Tua also had arguably the toughest chin in history - the man could take punches all night, and still keep swinging.

<p>I see that Solomon Haumono has called out Parker. </p>
<p> </p>
<p>Considering BoxRec has him at 108 and Parker at 11, I can't see any upside in this for Parker at all unless he needs to fill a schedule gap.</p>
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<p>People complain about Parker's record being against no-names, you should see Haumono's</p>

<p>The rankings on that BoxRec site are interesting. A very complex points system that make the World Rugby one look like kindergarten maths but essentially one that tries to determine points based on opponents rankings and the decisiveness of wins (eg what round, what decision was). Also takes into account the opposition's opposition. So if you were to lose to an up and comer ranked below you who also then went on next fight to demolish someone well above you as well, you don't cop it so much.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Anyway, for all the talk of Parker fighting bunnies, this seems to rebut that (comparatively speaking). He is fighting guys good enough to earn good points in this system. Is ranked 11 compared to Joshua at 16 (although that could be due to having 2 extra fights).</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Lining Parker up later in the year against someone like Erkan Teper or Luis Ortiz would seriously boost him up although, I daresay fights like that also need to fit into actual federation rankings to have effect.</p>