All Blacks 2022

@gt12 yeah he's got good hands too, seems a solid option taker.

@old-samurai-jack yep. He shows more than Sotutu and adds more in grafting yards than Ardie. He always is breaking the gain line. Ardie then to 7.

@bones said in All Blacks 2022:

Can't be far off being eligible?

Ainsley played for the Wallabies in 2018 so should be eligible this year for ABs (three year stand down period).

I agree he's been impressive.

@kiwimurph said in All Blacks 2022:

@bones said in All Blacks 2022:

Can't be far off being eligible?

Ainsley played for the Wallabies in 2018 so should be eligible this year for ABs (three year stand down period).

That still doesn't feel right to me.

I want to see brave selections in 2022, not afraid to leave out established players, something like this:

1. De Groot

2. Taukei'aho

3. Mafileo

4. Rettalick

5. Whitelock

6. Vaa'i

7. Papali'i

8. Ioane

9. Smith

10. Barrett

11. Ioane

12. Umaga-Jenson 1

13. Umaga-Jenson 2

14. Jordan

15. Barrett

16. Coles

17. Williams

18. A.Moli

19. Barrett

20. Savea

21. Fakatava

22. Mo'unga

23. Lienert-Brown

Greater emphasis on size and physicality in selecting the starting XV, and a lot less limited Crusaders players.

@kiwi_expat I like the concept but you still have three old locks that are failing to make ground.

@crucial said in All Blacks 2022:

@kiwi_expat I like the concept but you still have three old locks that are failing to make ground.

Yeah, I just wanted to retain some experience in there somewhere. But Scooter isn't that old.

McWhannell, Parkinson, Ah Kuoi, Josh Lord, Sam Darry, Fabian Holland, all need time to mature.

I just want players that fight for every inch and make the opposition do the same. The culling needs to be the passive runners and tacklers.

In that respect we need the likes of Ardie and Cane. Some argue that the balance is out but Cane at least makes runners fight for ground (as does Papali'i).while Ardie is all elbows and knees with great leg drive. I'd rather 5 metres from Ardie drawing in defenders to stop him than 7 metres from someone else that takes the tackle.
I get that AIoane can also attract defenders with a charge but his workrate and ground covered is nowhere near. Remember that the 8 is usually tasked with dropping back to support from a kick.

Definitely our old props need to go.
And there is no room at all for the likes of Bridge who cannot beat a tackle. Clarke and Reece can.

Edit: just checked some stats from ABs last year and Reece isn't much better than Bridge. Each only beat a defender once a game on average and it happens once every 7 runs.

Ioane beats defenders once every 4 runs at over 2 defenders beaten per game.
Jordan once every 4 runs at just under 2 per game
Dmac beat defenders once every 2.5 runs at 2 per game

The base numbers are arguable but are presumably consistent in the methodology of measuring so Jordan and Ioane are twice as good as Bridge and Reece.

@crucial said in All Blacks 2022:

Dmac beat defenders once every 2.5 runs at 2 per game

Are there separate statistics for defenders beaten whilst running forwards and running sideways or are they just all lumped together?

@higgins said in All Blacks 2022:

@crucial said in All Blacks 2022:

Dmac beat defenders once every 2.5 runs at 2 per game

Are there separate statistics for defenders beaten whilst running forwards and running sideways or are they just all lumped together?

That’s so 2018

@higgins said in All Blacks 2022:

@crucial said in All Blacks 2022:

Dmac beat defenders once every 2.5 runs at 2 per game

Are there separate statistics for defenders beaten whilst running forwards and running sideways or are they just all lumped together?

I thought @antipodean would have got in here with that comment first!

From the way he is going over here, I don't know that he'll want to come home. He's killing it, making heaps of cash, and is adored.

@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2022:

I want to see brave selections in 2022, not afraid to leave out established players, something like this:

1. De Groot

2. Taukei'aho

3. Mafileo

4. Rettalick

5. Whitelock

6. Vaa'i

7. Papali'i

8. Ioane

9. Smith

10. Barrett

11. Ioane

12. Umaga-Jenson 1

13. Umaga-Jenson 2

14. Jordan

15. Barrett

16. Coles

17. Williams

18. A.Moli

19. Barrett

20. Savea

21. Fakatava

22. Mo'unga

23. Lienert-Brown

Greater emphasis on size and physicality in selecting the starting XV, and a lot less limited Crusaders players.

If you play a lock at 6, then I think Selby-Rickitt looks to be more suited to that role.
I am not convinced by Mafileo. He is a strong scrummager and is absent in the loose. Ainsley is the form THP in the country.

I'd go with :

De Groot
Taukei'aho
Ainsley
Retallick
Whitelock
Ioane
Cane / Papali'i
Sowakula
Smith
Mo'unga
Clarke
T. Umaga-Jensen / J. Barrett
Ioane / P. Umaga-Jensen
Jordan / Ioane
J. Barrett / Jordan

Coles
Hogdman
Lomax
Barrett
Savea
Weber
B. Barrett
Fainganu'uku

@cgrant Ainsley played 3 time for the Wallabies in 2018 so likely not eligible. NZ born though.

@daffy-jaffy so he's now completed his 3 year stand down period and would therefore be eligible for the ABs?

@fakatavafuture Or has it now changed to five years? Then there was some Olympic loophole thing. I'm not up to speed with the latest rules.

@fakatavafuture said in All Blacks 2022:

@daffy-jaffy so he's now completed his 3 year stand down period and would therefore be eligible for the ABs?

He actually qualified last year, but as he was injured and didn't play, he has to wait for the 5 years, (end of this year) I think it starts from when he left college or something now too.

@dan54 said in All Blacks 2022:

@fakatavafuture said in All Blacks 2022:

@daffy-jaffy so he's now completed his 3 year stand down period and would therefore be eligible for the ABs?

He actually qualified last year, but as he was injured and didn't play, he has to wait for the 5 years, (end of this year) I think it starts from when he left college or something now too.

Sounds like you're talking about Fakatava, not Ainsley.

@bones said in All Blacks 2022:

@dan54 said in All Blacks 2022:

@fakatavafuture said in All Blacks 2022:

@daffy-jaffy so he's now completed his 3 year stand down period and would therefore be eligible for the ABs?

He actually qualified last year, but as he was injured and didn't play, he has to wait for the 5 years, (end of this year) I think it starts from when he left college or something now too.

Sounds like you're talking about Fakatava, not Ainsley.

Standard Fern diversion.

@daffy-jaffy said in All Blacks 2022:

@fakatavafuture Or has it now changed to five years? Then there was some Olympic loophole thing. I'm not up to speed with the latest rules.

5 years is to get residency for non born (or parents/g parents). Ainsley born in NZ, new rule that after 3 years of not playing test rugby you are then ‘re-eligible’ for your birth (parent/g parent) country. So Ainsley, born in NZ not played for wallabies for more than 3 years, is now eligible for ABs. Piutau, born in NZ but Tongan parents & hasn’t played for ABs for over 3 years, is now eligible for Tonga - etc. No need for Olympc loophole, which still works.

Consensus here seems to be that we can't ditch the old locks yet as the replacements aren't ready.

That points to a need to get them ready.

Vai'i and Lord are in the prime position to put their hands up playing alongside BBBR in Super.

It still may be a season too early for some but even so they need to be in the 23 mix to get experience. I would alternate starts alongside a veteran with another vet on the bench.
I like the energy that Vai'i brings but he seems to be lacking mass in collisions

the chance of us entering any big test this year without all of Whitelock, Retallic and Barrett is basically zero (as long as fit)

@mariner4life

Agreed, the ABs will be praying that they stay fit and in half decent form.

The rest will get game time but seem some time away from being able to make an impact in international rugby. Especially when they seem very lightweight in an era of heavyweight rugby.

Honestly, it seems like the ABs are like the Boks in the 80’s and that we are isolated from how the rest of the world is playing rugby

@dagrubster we were ahead for a long time. But the pack has definitely caught us. Meanwhile we are in a low period

@canefan

Yeah, I know. Don’t want to elaborate further as I find that when I post it is normally negative!!

@dagrubster maybe if they played better you could be more upbeat....

@dan54 said in All Blacks 2022:

@fakatavafuture said in All Blacks 2022:

@daffy-jaffy so he's now completed his 3 year stand down period and would therefore be eligible for the ABs?

He actually qualified last year, but as he was injured and didn't play, he has to wait for the 5 years, (end of this year) I think it starts from when he left college or something now too.

Whoops yep sorry mate, looked at your nic and didn't read everything!!!:beaming_face_with_smiling_eyes:

Fitzy said Fozzie knows where he's going!

As for the All Blacks, Fitzpatrick certainly isn’t panicking.

“I think he (Foster) knows where he’s going, that’s for sure. We’re 18 months out from the World Cup, and traditionally, we haven’t worked in four-year cycles. Every year we try to pick the best team to win the (Rugby) Championship, or whatever tour we’re on,” Fitzpatrick said.

@canefan

Haha! Yeah, I genuinely don’t let the AB results affect my mood.

Wasn’t always the case though!

I do believe there is potentially a pretty good side that could emerge for the ABs here but there are a few challenges to overcome for that to happen. Mainly numbers 1-23 and the coaching staff 🤪

Codie Taylor signed by NZ rugby till the end of 2025.

The ABs are allowed to drop mediocre forwards, right?

@tim said in All Blacks 2022:

View embedded content

Codie Taylor signed by NZ rugby till the end of 2025.

The ABs are allowed to drop mediocre forwards, right?

Why oh why? He seems to be on the decline.

@canes4life Third ranked hooker right now, with Aumua pushing him hard.

@tim Aumua has been excellent to start the year, same with Samisoni. Only ?? around both of them was their throwing but they’ve been superb in the early rounds of Super Rugby. Both offer the physicality needed at test level, something Taylor just doesn’t have unfortunately.

@tim I'd have Taylor as 4th choice behind Taukeiaho, Aumua and Coles (in that order).

@canes4life TBF I like that he is sticking about, we need guys like him playing Super, NPC and even club in the twilight of thier careers, but given where he is at this stage of his AB career I hope the contract value is appropriate.

Maybe he, like Whitelock were just tired last year, and if managed appropriately this year, could get back to what we expect.

We saw that long term contract Julian Savea signed when his AB career was almost done, he ended up gettign released early didnt he (at his request?)

Taylor showed his worth when he came on for the Crusaders last week, his experience was invaluable. I do wonder if test rugby has evolved away from his style of play though. Taukeiaho offers that go forward and big munter impact we need at test level.

@old-samurai-jack said in All Blacks 2022:

Taylor showed his worth when he came on for the Crusaders last week, his experience was invaluable. I do wonder if test rugby has evolved away from his style of play though. Taukeiaho offers that go forward and big munter impact we need at test level.

Nah, he's just been in poor form, unlike Coles who has managed to maintain his form in between bouts of injury.

NZ Form Team so far:

15 Barrett
14 Telea
13 Ioane
12 TUJ
11 Rayasi
10 Perofeta
9 Smith
8 Savea
7 Cane
6 Sowakula
5 Goodhue
4 Vaii
3 Mafileo
2 Taukei'aho
1 Hodgman

@tim said in All Blacks 2022:

4 Vaii

Funny. Am a fanboi but didn't see him standing out.

Still got 30 min to go on Chiefs v Sith but he hasn't stood out to me so far.

P.S. Retallick did some good things early on the game.

@tim said in All Blacks 2022:

NZ Form Team so far:

15 Barrett
14 Telea
13 Ioane
12 TUJ
11 Rayasi
10 Perofeta
9 Smith
8 Savea
7 Cane
6 Sowakula
5 Goodhue
4 Vaii
3 Mafileo
2 Taukei'aho
1 Hodgman

Hahaha