@Crazy-Horse said in Lions v Crusaders - Super Rugby Final:

Apologies for going off topic but @booboo I thought it had as much to do about the international audience? If I am wrong and it is for domestic purposes, I say fuck that and give us more day time games. It seems like the players aren't being given the best conditions to excel in. I know it is a different scenario to Super rugby, but maybe a few more of those passes would have stuck in the third BIL test if it was played in the day time.

It's all about money.

We want Super Rugby the trade off is the majority of games get played 7.30.

It's been reported on numerous occasions and stated by people like Tew that Sky pay more (apparently significantly so) to have the gsmes in prime time.

Jack is a reasonable ref.

But just for appearances sake surely you go with Gardner who at the very least is as capable and has the added bonus of not being from either of the countries involved.

Another thing. Jaco will no doubt be aware of the criticism and the suggestion that he's not neutral. Wouldn't that be a good motivation for him to try to be as neutral & good as he can be this Saturday? Unless he's really biased, of course. I have more of an issue with vdW and Jonker, although they are still better than van Heerden and Veld (remember that Blues game in SA).

Having said that, I find it incomprehensible that they use the argument that Jackson was the ref last year in Wellington to justify the appointment of Peyper. Two wrongs don't make things right. You should always go for the most neutral ref if there is a good & suitable one available, in this case Gardner.

Anyway, I think the travel factor & altitude will be a more important reason for a possible Crusaders' loss, than the refs.

@Stargazer said in Lions v Crusaders - Super Rugby Final:

I have more of an issue with vdW and Jonker,

Bonkers Jonker. Really? For a "super" final?

Is the reward for being a shit ref a comfy chair and making decisions while watching tele? I would qualify (as did Ayoub).
I'm going to apply.

@mariner4life said in Lions v Crusaders - Super Rugby Final:

who the fuck physically lines up for tickets?

The online ticketing agent Computicket.co.za gets given the bulk of the tickets to sell, but a few are also held by the stadium. The the guys queuing up most likely had already checked online and seen it was sold out. Its always just been this way in S.A for some reason.

It's not altitude so much as attitude. If the Saders turn up in the right frame of mind,they will win.

@booboo said in Lions v Crusaders - Super Rugby Final:

Jack is a reasonable ref.

But just for appearances sake surely you go with Gardner who at the very least is as capable and has the added bonus of not being from either of the countries involved.

The appointments smack of SANZAAR being arrogant or incompetent or both

That's great, the only non south African ref is a hometown ref..

RiP Crusaders

@mimic said in Lions v Crusaders - Super Rugby Final:

That's great, the only non south African ref is a hometown ref..

RiP Crusaders

Someone's done a deal there

This is good for the Crusaders. Peyper is not a hometown ref IMO, and following last week if anything he will overcompensate to prove he isn't one.

Also Peyper grew up in Bloemfontein and went to Grey College. There is every chance he grew up with as much loyalty to the Lions as a Crusaders fan would for the Blues. He isn't going to blow his international career over a relatively unimportant fixture like this.

Probably should have had a neutral or NZ TMO from an optics stand point.

I like Peyper as a referee, I think he's excellent and anything but partisan. He's prone to the odd crap decision, but that's just the game of rugby being incredibly hard to referee. Gardner would have made more sense, but Peyper is still the choice I expected and think is an OK choice. I don't get the hate for Marius vdW, I think he's been very good this year (and the last, I believe).

Yeah I like how Peyper manages a game, probably in the top 3 going around IMO. I agree with SANZAR that it's merit based because he's an excellent ref. Congrats to him.

Jack O'Piper is a good ref and communicates well. I'm sure he won't be consciously biased. And all refs tend to favour the home team. I'd have preferred Gardner, who I rate a notch above Glen (Ireland's favourite ref).

The bigger issue is the TMO, and, in particular, who controls the replays which are chosen. IMHO that is where the most heinous bias is shown. I'm recalling Messam tackle, which Burger did not complain about real time, but TV replays forced ref to come back to after the event.

What pisses me off is where was this merit based ref selection during the Lions series? Instead of having a guy like Nigel Owens in charge we get those french fucks because they are "neutral".

I understand it's SANZAAR vs WR but some consistency wouldn't hurt.

SuperSports analysis on lineout and mauls

Unchanged Lions squad for the final:

1 Jacques van Rooyen
2 Malcolm Marx
3 Ruan Dreyer
4 Andries Ferreira
5 Franco Mostert
6 Jaco Kriel
7 Albertus “Kwagga” Smith
8 Ruan Ackermann
9 Ross Cronje
10 Elton Jantjies
11 Courtnall Skosan
12 Harold Vorster
13 Lionel Mapoe
14 Ruan Combrinck
15 Andries Coetzee

Reserves
16 Akker vd Merwe
17 Corne Fourie
18 Johannes Jonker
19 Lourens Erasmus
20 Cyle Brink
21 Faf de Klerk
22 Rohan Janse van Re
23 Sylvian Mahuza

@antipodean

Am i missing something here, these guys keep on talking about sacking is tackling 1 player. But the maul laws is about tackling the ball carrier, whether the maul is set or not if the ball player is tackled its within the law

Razor has also named an unchanged squad.

This is the Crusaders team for the final:

1 Joe Moody
2 Codie Taylor
3 Owen Franks
4 Scott Barrett
5 Sam Whitelock (C)
6 Jordan Taufua
7 Matt Todd (VC)
8 Kieran Read
9 Bryn Hall
10 Richie Mo'unga
11 Seta Tamanivalu
12 Ryan Crotty (VC)
13 Jack Goodhue
14 Israel Dagg
15 David Havili

RESERVES
16 Ben Funnell
17 Wyatt Crockett
18 Michael Alaalatoa
19 Luke Romano
20 Pete Samu
21 Mitchell Drummond
22 Mitchell Hunt
23 George Bridge

@Rebound

And the laws of the game does not clarify collapsing of the maul at all

@Stargazer it's amazing to think that he's coached a side to the top of the comp. He comes across as a lanky laid back surfer who's coaching a social pub side, co-sponsored by the local hemp store and KFC.

Seems a really good coach though, and the pros love him just as much as the schoolboys.

Podcast: Sumo & Mils

@Rebound said in Lions v Crusaders - Super Rugby Final:

@Rebound

And the laws of the game does not clarify collapsing of the maul at all

Because you aren't collapsing a maul, you're tackling the ball carrier. Given the definition of a maul requires the ball carrier to be held by an opposition player, if you immediately tackle him, he isn't held.

Who remembers the first Super Rugby 10 final? I was 16. English and Afrikaans commentating.

Loved how the crowd counts when Grant Fox takes his kick. So much memories that day.

@antipodean I saw something on TV today saying that no Crusader fans would likely have been unable to get to go to watch this game (unless they anticipated this game weeks ago) as it takes about a month for a SA Visa at present

@taniwharugby Lots of Crusaders fans already in SA!

@taniwharugby said in Lions v Crusaders - Super Rugby Final:

@antipodean I saw something on TV today saying that no Crusader fans would likely have been unable to get to go to watch this game (unless they anticipated this game weeks ago) as it takes about a month for a SA Visa at present

That's really shit.

@taniwharugby

@Frye said in Lions v Crusaders - Super Rugby Final:

@taniwharugby said in Lions v Crusaders - Super Rugby Final:

@antipodean I saw something on TV today saying that no Crusader fans would likely have been unable to get to go to watch this game (unless they anticipated this game weeks ago) as it takes about a month for a SA Visa at present

That's really shit.

That SA is responding in kind to NZ's lead?

@MiketheSnow said in Lions v Crusaders - Super Rugby Final:

@Frye said in Lions v Crusaders - Super Rugby Final:

@taniwharugby said in Lions v Crusaders - Super Rugby Final:

@antipodean I saw something on TV today saying that no Crusader fans would likely have been unable to get to go to watch this game (unless they anticipated this game weeks ago) as it takes about a month for a SA Visa at present

That's really shit.

That SA is responding in kind to NZ's lead?

From a rugby perspective it is shit for Crusaders fans.

From a political perspective.... I'm not sure. If they've slowed the process down for NZers than that is petty. But if NZ passports are just going through the same process as everyone else now then that I guess is just indicative of the terribly slow bureaucratic process in SA government in general.

For the record: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Peace_Index
NZ is ranked the 2nd safest country in the world. South Africa is ranked 123rd.

Kind of deluded to think the threat to each country is anywhere close to being in the same ballpark.

NZ tightened the entry on SA passports because of a big increase in both dodgy SA passports and dodgy SA people lying.
Reciprocal rights have therefore disappeared

Quite interesting reading looking at previous finals:

For the UK viewers the match is on the Sky Sports Mix channel from 14.30

121 Sky Sports Mix HD
287 Sky Sports Mix

The new sports set up is already getting on my wick.

About the only time since about round 6 that I've had genuine doubts that the Crusaders will win this comp.

Lions are good -not their fault the draw is fucked. They have that ability to put on lots of points in a short space of time, and I'm yet to see them tire at the end.
Crowd should be superb.

As I look around the world rugby landscape, and the amount of "victim" and whinging unions around at the moment I feel the kinship with the Saffas is as strong as ever. Good rugby folk, the fans, who pretty much see the game and rugby culture the way we do. Mutual respect is a rare commodity these days.

The winner tonight will deserve it wholeheartedly

Crusaders could nick this though (the away team disadvantage in a final thing is undeniably strong), and it'll be through massive pro-active defence and then trying to control possession and territory - which is a wank way of saying they must play top rugby in all facets for 80 mins - that'd be good to watch.

Kicking at altitude is going to be a good battle, an Izzy blinder would be good to see

can't help but want a win to add to Razor's legend - whatever he does certainly works

Big send off for Ackermann too though

Fuck should be a ripper.

I hate every other kiwi team that not's mine, but it's fun supporting the other fluffybunnies at times!

Lions to win though

@MiketheSnow Fuck yeah it is a complete bucketful of shite. FFS how many wendyball channels do we need?? Plus is there really a need for stand-alone golf and cricket channels?? I think Sky Sports has over-estimated their own popularity, or perhaps feeling the heat from BT Sport and web-based live-streaming sports channels.

Back on topic - I feel for Saders fans who want to travel but can't because of visa changes. The whole world has gone mad with this sort of shite.

@MiketheSnow said in Lions v Crusaders - Super Rugby Final:

For the UK viewers the match is on the Sky Sports Mix channel from 14.30

121 Sky Sports Mix HD
287 Sky Sports Mix

The new sports set up is already getting on my wick.

Mine too. I have just discovered that my Virgin package doesn't have that channel. I only pay them so I can watch the rugby and now it's been moved off my package. Fuckers.

Jantjies misses the drop