@jimmyb said in All Blacks v Springboks I:

@nzzp said in All Blacks v Springboks I:

@jimmyb I guess what I struggle with is 'he created all these players and built a fantastic team' and 'the current players are shit but he won't drop them'. Feels like both shouldn't be true at the same time - if he is as good at developing players as claimed, surely he'd either coach these players to be better - or drop them.

I still sheet our issues back to Super getting too big, the quality plummetting and (in my opinion) not preparing players for Tests that well any more.

He needs to drop them. Should have happened last year. He hasn’t been brave enough with his selections. But every young player that’s come into the ABs set up and has received coaching, is looking that much better for it.

No one can tell me that DMac is literally uncoachable. He hasn’t improved a single facet of his game for 4 years. Ditto with B Barrett and Savea.

is or isn't?
4 years ago McKenzie was a sideways running fullback who relied entirely on his own evasive abilities. He's changed heaps in that time, turning into the best 10 in Super rugby. People talking about him and Barrett as if they are the same are just wrong.

@jimmyb Dmac was the best international 10 in world rugby last year.

@Snowy said in All Blacks v Springboks I:

I hope so but based on the Argie game we have 2 weeks to learn to pass, catch and kick. Given that we seem to lack the ability to even learn the laws (or at least obey them) it seems unlikely that we will achieve even one of those.

Well, maybe you've frozen some good backs and left them to chill downstairs?

@nzzp said in All Blacks v Springboks I:

@jimmyb I guess what I struggle with is 'he created all these players and built a fantastic team' and 'the current players are shit but he won't drop them'. Feels like both shouldn't be true at the same time - if he is as good at developing players as claimed, surely he'd either coach these players to be better - or drop them.

I still sheet our issues back to Super getting too big, the quality plummetting and (in my opinion) not preparing players for Tests that well any more.

It is possible that he could select players with potential but others at Crusaders HQ would develop them - and he doesn't have those staff/that environment any more?

@nostrildamus said in All Blacks v Springboks I:

Well, maybe you've frozen some good backs and left them to chill downstairs?

No I leave the good ones alone, but some of the current ones might get an "invitation" to the cellar the way they are going.

@Snowy said in All Blacks v Springboks I:

@nostrildamus said in All Blacks v Springboks I:

Well, maybe you've frozen some good backs and left them to chill downstairs?

No I leave the good ones alone, but some of the current ones might get an "invitation" to the cellar the way they are going.

Better to extend the invitation to the coaching team......

Remember how good Jane, Dagg and Kahui were under the high ball?

We've really got no one even near that on a consistent basis.

Any Super level winger or fullback should have it spelled out pretty clearly that they don't get into the ABs unless their aerial game is top notch - both offensively and defensively. They should also all know how to kick it reasonably well. And if they haven't got it, learn it. Else we are permanent targets there.

And that goes for future wingers like Carter or Tangitau as well.

The ABs should have a national skills coach visiting Super level sides constantly training and assessing these skills and giving them new targets. Reporting directly to the AB coaches. If there is no improvement, they don't get into the ABs.

@Frank said in All Blacks v Springboks I:

We've really got no one even near that on a consistent basis.

Caleb is pretty good in the air to be fair. Just injured.

@ShaquilleOatmeal said in All Blacks v Springboks I:

As much as I'd like to see certain changes in the backline, I'm not expecting it to happen. Robertson seems like more of a motivator than coach - he leaves the coaching up to the other guys. At the Crusaders, with the majority of the side All Blacks, he could motivate the players to play to their ability and that'd do the job against a side with a handful of internationals. But when the playing field is even and the opposition is just as motivated, you need ruthless systems. Right now, the team doesn’t look like they have them.

The motivator vs coach idea also fits with the way he tries to be mates with the players and the cheesy “walk together” stuff, which is less like strategy and more like a way to keep them onside so he can fire them up. That might explain his reluctance to drop senior guys too. He sees the level they've played to in the past and thinks he can motivate them to play to that level. It works when you’ve got the best squad in the comp, but at test level sentiment can’t come before standards.

Robertson seems to be a vibes guy.

At the Crusdaers the squad was the squad and the faces were the same week to week.
You could move a Havili from 12 to 15 or 10 in a pinch or big Leicester to wing or centre as required.

The team essentially picked itself, everyone was happy and on message and the talent got them over the line.

Now he has 5 Super Rugby teams to pick from........and he doesnt know what to do and hasnt got the heart to drop anyone.

Decision paralysis.

Just digressing:

We all know the ABs haven't lost at Eden Park since 1994.

Two questions (ok 2 and a half), without Google:

1. When did the Springboks last win at Eden Park?
2. When did the the All Blacks last not win at Eden Park?
   2a. Against who? What year?

@booboo

1. 1937

2. It was a draw against the Lions in 2017. The ABs also drew against the Springboks there in 1994.

@sparky said in All Blacks v Springboks I:

@booboo

1. 1937

2. It was a draw against the Lions in 2017. The ABs also drew against the Springboks there in 1994.

Spoilsport. But correct. Virtual chocolate fish to you.

@Frank you mean like when Mike Cron did that?

Plenty of issues in our national game that are.clear to see, yet doesn't seem anyone addressing it or even concerned there is nothing being done to rectify it.

@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v Springboks I:

@Frank you mean like when Mike Cron did that?

Plenty of issues in our national game that are.clear to see, yet doesn't seem anyone addressing it or even concerned there is nothing being done to rectify it.

Would have thought the likes of Spencer, Nonu, Jane, Carter, McCaw, Mealamu, Whitelock would all be guys that would be sought after to instill mindset, skills and training into this generation.

Instead we get Dagg acting like a fucking buffoon talking about betting.

Maybe Razor just isn't doing enough breakdances to clear his mind?

@Bones Dagg was part of the original bomb squad, he could probably be helpful.

Sure ex players dont always make good coaches, but I am sure some of these guys could provide some good input and things that helped them.

Posting here, although comments based on Pumas 2.

Three main areas of concern:

1. Aerial. We are holed below water line. Need AFL style coaching toot sweet;

2. Backline. Seemed impossible to run backline moves because forwards were constantly in the way. Can’t we just run some straight backline moves?
   DMac created space whereas BB was shackled by Puma D.
   Jordie seems clunky. Like to see miss passes straight to 13. Would have liked to see Tupaea get a run outside DMac at 12.
   Taking Proctor off for Quinn seemed to solve nothing. Would have been better to push Jordie into back three and let Proctor have a run with Tupaea inside;

3. Loosies. As I feared, the formulaic selection was a failure. A balanced trio needs to encompass a fetcher, a ball slower, jumper, cleaner, smasher, and explosive runner. To a degree who does which isn’t so important. We ended up with no real fetcher, no ball slower and no smasher. The second Puma try highlighted the need for a 6 who’s used to defending off scrums.
   In fact when Sititi came on it would have been better if Vaa’i had gone to lock, perhaps replacing Scooter, and Parker to six.
   I think TWM should treat Sititi and Savea as 8s, and only have one on field at a time, Parker and Finau as 6s and Kirifi and Jacobson as 7s, Lakai seems to genuinely cover 7 and 8, and would have been a better bet than RD at 7.