NFL

@Cyclops said in NFL Season 2020/21:

He looked very good when the Rams had the cap space to surround him with talent. Goff is a trap, just like Wentz. You either want a genuine franchise qb or an obvious mid tier candidate who is cheaper. Rams should have tried to trade Goff away instead.

Jimmy G too. These big contracts are no biggie, they are generally not guaranteed (some of the total money will be guaranteed) so Goff, Wentz, and Jimmy G could all be released at the end of the season if their teams wanted to. The only problem is if they have drafted a ready to play replacement or if they can buy a ready to play QB

@canefan said in NFL Season 2020/21:

@Cyclops said in NFL Season 2020/21:

He looked very good when the Rams had the cap space to surround him with talent. Goff is a trap, just like Wentz. You either want a genuine franchise qb or an obvious mid tier candidate who is cheaper. Rams should have tried to trade Goff away instead.

Jimmy G too. These big contracts are no biggie, they are generally not guaranteed (some of the total money will be guaranteed) so Goff, Wentz, and Jimmy G could all be released at the end of the season if their teams wanted to. The only problem is if they have drafted a ready to play replacement or if they can buy a ready to play QB

I'm not sure releasing Wentz or Goff is that realistic. If the Eagles release Wentz, they get a massive $59 million dead cap penalty. If the Rams release Goff, they get an even bigger $65 million dead cap penalty. It's far better to keep them on the roster than to release them. Even trying to trade them will be very tough.

Jimmy G is different though. 49ers will save a lot of money releasing him.

KC win a close one to get to the Championship game. That last run by Mahomes to get them within inches of the 1st down was inspired. Then the play call on 4th and inches was gutsy as all fuck.

@mariner4life Do you mean the backup QB Henne?

Mahomes left the game with concussion halfway through the 3rd quarter.

on the QB thing, i have a huge amount of sympathy for organisations with regards to QBs and their contracts. It's a QB league, you cannot win without a good one. Shit, even the SB won by the Broncos based on our defense, we still needed a first ballot hall of famer under centre to run the game.

Look at this weekend, Brady and Brees are on now, Rogers won yesterday. Mahomes won this morning. Allen might be the MVP. You need a great QB to win.

If a guy gets you to a Superbowl (or in one case, wins one) then you pay him, or someone else will, because he looks like the guy. It's a risk, but you have no other choice. Going cheap is a bigger risk, because i reckon lightening needs to strike for a "solid" QB to win you a SB.

@KiwiMurph said in NFL Season 2020/21:

@mariner4life Do you mean the backup QB Henne?

Mahomes left the game with concussion halfway through the 3rd quarter.

was that Henne? holy shit!! i didn't get to watch most of the game because of the timing and getting to work, i turned it on for that last drive but it was muted on my phone.

go that man! he made that last throw then as well! that call looks even gutsier!!

i love plays like that

@mariner4life said in NFL Season 2020/21:

on the QB thing, i have a huge amount of sympathy for organisations with regards to QBs and their contracts. It's a QB league, you cannot win without a good one. Shit, even the SB won by the Broncos based on our defense, we still needed a first ballot hall of famer under centre to run the game.

Look at this weekend, Brady and Brees are on now, Rogers won yesterday. Mahomes won this morning. Allen might be the MVP. You need a great QB to win.

If a guy gets you to a Superbowl (or in one case, wins one) then you pay him, or someone else will, because he looks like the guy. It's a risk, but you have no other choice. Going cheap is a bigger risk, because i reckon lightening needs to strike for a "solid" QB to win you a SB.

The counter argument is that getting to a Super Bowl doesn't prove you are good enough to win a Super Bowl. Goff, Jimmy G, heck Rex Grossman made a Super Bowl as QB.

Unless you are an elite QB then all you are doing as an organisation is paying a huge part of your salary cap for a QB who can't win you a Super Bowl.

The Chiefs have shown the way - they had Alex Smith - a QB good enough to get you deep into the playoffs but not good enough to win you a Super Bowl - so they traded up in the first round to get a QB they thought could take them to the next level (and a lot cheaper than Alex Smith) and they were right.

If you are going to have a QB that you have to carry as a team anyway - you might as well go with someone on their rookie deal cos they are a hell of a lot cheaper.

@KiwiMurph said in NFL Season 2020/21:

@mariner4life said in NFL Season 2020/21:

on the QB thing, i have a huge amount of sympathy for organisations with regards to QBs and their contracts. It's a QB league, you cannot win without a good one. Shit, even the SB won by the Broncos based on our defense, we still needed a first ballot hall of famer under centre to run the game.

Look at this weekend, Brady and Brees are on now, Rogers won yesterday. Mahomes won this morning. Allen might be the MVP. You need a great QB to win.

If a guy gets you to a Superbowl (or in one case, wins one) then you pay him, or someone else will, because he looks like the guy. It's a risk, but you have no other choice. Going cheap is a bigger risk, because i reckon lightening needs to strike for a "solid" QB to win you a SB.

The counter argument is that getting to a Super Bowl doesn't prove you are good enough to win a Super Bowl. Goff, Jimmy G, heck Rex Grossman made a Super Bowl as QB.

Unless you are an elite QB then all you are doing as an organisation is paying a huge part of your salary cap for a QB who can't win you a Super Bowl.

The Chiefs have shown the way - they had Alex Smith - a QB good enough to get you deep into the playoffs but not good enough to win you a Super Bowl - so they traded up in the first round to get a QB they thought could take them to the next level (and a lot cheaper than Alex Smith) and they were right.

If you are going to have a QB that you have to carry as a team anyway - you might as well go with someone on their rookie deal cos they are a hell of a lot cheaper.

the counter-counter argument is the sheer number of "QBs who can take you to the next level" that come out of college and do fuck all. If Mahomes went the way of a large number of other great college QBs then they are in no mans land, again.

The Eagles are the best illustration. Wenz looks like an MVP, gets hurt, and his replacement comes in and wins a fucking Superbowl. You gotta pick one, because teams want both, so they pick Wentz. And you gotta hope you picked right, because you're tying yourself to him.

Turns out both were wrong, but there is no way you could know that.

@mariner4life said in NFL Season 2020/21:

@KiwiMurph said in NFL Season 2020/21:

@mariner4life said in NFL Season 2020/21:

on the QB thing, i have a huge amount of sympathy for organisations with regards to QBs and their contracts. It's a QB league, you cannot win without a good one. Shit, even the SB won by the Broncos based on our defense, we still needed a first ballot hall of famer under centre to run the game.

Look at this weekend, Brady and Brees are on now, Rogers won yesterday. Mahomes won this morning. Allen might be the MVP. You need a great QB to win.

If a guy gets you to a Superbowl (or in one case, wins one) then you pay him, or someone else will, because he looks like the guy. It's a risk, but you have no other choice. Going cheap is a bigger risk, because i reckon lightening needs to strike for a "solid" QB to win you a SB.

The counter argument is that getting to a Super Bowl doesn't prove you are good enough to win a Super Bowl. Goff, Jimmy G, heck Rex Grossman made a Super Bowl as QB.

Unless you are an elite QB then all you are doing as an organisation is paying a huge part of your salary cap for a QB who can't win you a Super Bowl.

The Chiefs have shown the way - they had Alex Smith - a QB good enough to get you deep into the playoffs but not good enough to win you a Super Bowl - so they traded up in the first round to get a QB they thought could take them to the next level (and a lot cheaper than Alex Smith) and they were right.

If you are going to have a QB that you have to carry as a team anyway - you might as well go with someone on their rookie deal cos they are a hell of a lot cheaper.

the counter-counter argument is the sheer number of "QBs who can take you to the next level" that come out of college and do fuck all. If Mahomes went the way of a large number of other great college QBs then they are in no mans land, again.

The Eagles are the best illustration. Wenz looks like an MVP, gets hurt, and his replacement comes in and wins a fucking Superbowl. You gotta pick one, because teams want both, so they pick Wentz. And you gotta hope you picked right, because you're tying yourself to him.

Turns out both were wrong, but there is no way you could know that.

To me that's a different scenario though - Wentz flashed enough where you could understand why the Eagles signed him. As you say Wentz was playing an MVP level.

As you say they were forced into making a decision.

My issue is with guys like Goff who never showed that level - heck he got to the Super Bowl and put up a whopping 3 points in that game.

They weren't forced into signing Goff when they did.

After that Super Bowl, after Goff's 3rd year (of a 5 year rookie deal) they signed him to a 4 year extension that at that point in time had the most guaranteed money of any contract in NFL history ($110 mil). He still had 2 years to run on his rookie deal - they rushed into signing him to huge money when they didn't have to and are now stuck.

look i hear you. There were enough questions around Goff his whole career that his contract looked out of whack. I guess i just have a level of sympathy that after a guy gets you to the Superbowl, cutting him, while alpha as fuck, is an enormous risk. That contract was probably a bigger risk.

But it happens so often that there has to be some other underlying reason for it.

this is a really good game by the way. Exactly as you would expect.

@mariner4life Brady certainly looks to have more left in his arm than Brees.

@KiwiMurph said in NFL Season 2020/21:

@mariner4life Brady certainly looks to have more left in his arm than Brees.

astounding isn't it?

Though i've noticed a couple of times Brady can't throw 2 "long" passes in a row. He's still elite at finding open guys though.

@mariner4life said in NFL Season 2020/21:

@KiwiMurph said in NFL Season 2020/21:

@mariner4life Brady certainly looks to have more left in his arm than Brees.

astounding isn't it?

Though i've noticed a couple of times Brady can't throw 2 "long" passes in a row. He's still elite at finding open guys though.

Genuine question.

Could Brady potentially win the Super Bowl with this new team of his or is it just a too bigger step to get there.

Is he already generally regarded as the GOAT? (I don't know the answer)

@Hooroo said in NFL Season 2020/21:

@mariner4life said in NFL Season 2020/21:

@KiwiMurph said in NFL Season 2020/21:

@mariner4life Brady certainly looks to have more left in his arm than Brees.

astounding isn't it?

Though i've noticed a couple of times Brady can't throw 2 "long" passes in a row. He's still elite at finding open guys though.

Genuine question.

Could Brady potentially win the Super Bowl with this new team of his or is it just a too bigger step to get there.

Is he already generally regarded as the GOAT? (I don't know the answer)

can they win? Yes. Do i expect them to? no

Is he the GOAT? yes. i can't stand him, but he's the fucking GOAT

that said, without two interceptions/fumbles, they don't have touchdowns, so once again he's being carried by his defence...

another pick. incredible. Tampa defense owning Brees

Finally get to see Rodgers v Brady in the playoffs.

Can't wait for next week. Both games will be crackers.

Seems everyone is convinced Brees will retire

Shout out to the Browns for putting in today against the Chiefs.

Man I’d love to see the Chiefs beat the Bills.

@ACT-Crusader Do you mean Bills beat the Chiefs?

Surely the Bills have the support of the neutrals given their tortured history and what a Super Bowl would mean for that city.

@KiwiMurph nah I’ve never liked the Bills and the Patriots. The Dolphins were one of my favourite teams as a kid and there was the rivalry with the Bills that we always got into.

The Bills winning would be great story after the heartache of losing 4 consecutive SB games to the NFC East in the 1990s.

@Bovidae said in NFL Season 2020/21:

The Bills winning would be great story after the heartache of losing 4 consecutive SB games to the NFC East in the 1990s.

Would be redemption as it was for the Broncos who lost 5 SBs before winning their last 3

god, i am watching First Take, and it is EVERYTHING i hate about modern sports journalism. Take away the fact Stephen A is on, so it's all bombastic bullshit, but

the never ending quest for "narrative" just does my head in. And they way they can boil complex discussions down to one game, or one period.

Apparently, this weekend is huge for Mahomes legacy. The fuck? One championship game for a guy who has already won everything there is to win in like 3 seasons?

The continued need to define everything about a player/team based on one result is incredible to me. Even good sports teams lose. Even great players lose. It's fucked.

The other one we've touched on is how this season will define Curry. What the actual fuck?

I've seen the same thing about rugby, how a loss means one player from the loser team is obviously inferior to his opposite in the winning side.

Modern sports journalism can die in a fire

Stephen A and Skip Bayless make amoeba seem intelligent.

@mariner4life and it’s only Championship week. It turns up about 10 notches in the SB off week....

Philip Rivers does retire.

Really good career at a small team. And finished with a pretty fucking good year at the Colts too

No better player in the league to have mic'd up too. Funny guy constantly chirping the defense.

The quarterback scene is going to be fascinating to watch this offseason.

You've got Saints and Colts with their QBs retired - Steelers with their QB on his last legs - Watson wanting out of Texans - multiple teams supposedly looking for new QBs (e.g. 49ers, Bears) - a strong QB class in the upcoming Draft with 4-5 QBs expected to go in the first round.

@KiwiMurph said in NFL Season 2020/21:

The quarterback scene is going to be fascinating to watch this offseason.

You've got Saints and Colts with their QBs retired - Steelers with their QB on his last legs - Watson wanting out of Texans - multiple teams supposedly looking for new QBs (e.g. 49ers, Bears) - a strong QB class in the upcoming Draft with 4-5 QBs expected to go in the first round.

there could be a massive amount of change.

I hope some of it is in Denver

@KiwiMurph said in NFL Season 2020/21:

The quarterback scene is going to be fascinating to watch this offseason.

You've got Saints and Colts with their QBs retired - Steelers with their QB on his last legs - Watson wanting out of Texans - multiple teams supposedly looking for new QBs (e.g. 49ers, Bears) - a strong QB class in the upcoming Draft with 4-5 QBs expected to go in the first round.

I'd love to see Watson in a Niners uniform.....

@canefan So would I but I think the 49ers will be outbid for his services.

there's a bit of pressure on him at a new team i think. there's a bit of drama around his exit, he's had a good set of excuses at the Texans. If he doesn't perform to a very high level at the next place he's gonna cop it.

@mariner4life said in NFL Season 2020/21:

there's a bit of pressure on him at a new team i think. there's a bit of drama around his exit, he's had a good set of excuses at the Texans. If he doesn't perform to a very high level at the next place he's gonna cop it.

I disagree. The pressure is on the Texans to replace Watson. That place is a dumpster fire. They traded away DeAndre Hopkins for peanuts.

Watson has done nothing but play at a very high level all 4 seasons he's been in the league at the Texans.

Watson just had his best statistical season - 33 touchdowns, 7 picks, 70% completion. He hasn't had one bad year in the league yet.

Of course any high profile QB that doesn't perform at a high level is going to cop it - but it's the Texans that are looking bad in this stoush - not Watson - he's not exactly known as a diva.

@KiwiMurph fair comment, i would take him in a heartbeat.

my comment was, he's going to get paid, and sort of based on our convo the other day, there is even more pressure on an incoming highly paid QB, than one already in place. Less fan patience as well.

@KiwiMurph said in NFL Season 2020/21:

@canefan So would I but I think the 49ers will be outbid for his services.

Sadly yes

Seems like the front runners for Watson are the Jets and the Dolphins. Hope he ends up in Miami, they would become Superbowl contenders overnight.

@barbarian said in NFL Season 2020/21:

Seems like the front runners for Watson are the Jets and the Dolphins. Hope he ends up in Miami, they would become Superbowl contenders overnight.

QB swap?