All Blacks 2024

@MN5 said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@Bones said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@canefan hence why I put "hated". Not, hated.

New Zealand ( well, and any other countries in the world ) has some absolutely munterish “fans”.

I remember how hated Mark Carter was and that was before the days of social media. What the fuck did he ever do to deserve that ?

I agree so much, Carter wasn't anything great, but was pk, didn't deserve the crap he got. Have seen it over the years where some rugby watchers expect every AB named to be a great or he isn't good enough, and so cops rubbish from people who generally aren't good enough to play top club rugby! Even with Donald, I agree he was limited in natural ability, but still the players I always love as a lot of what they do is through often hard work rather than natural ability? True greats like McCaw and Carter combine thet lot exceptional natural ability with never leaving a stone unturned to make sure everything is as good as possible. Always remember seeing a test in Brisbanes , I got there early, and it was to be noted that McCaw and Dan Carter were actually out on field going through warm ups etc probably 5 minutes before the rest of team.

Stuff understands Barrett’s new contract with New Zealand Rugby and the Blues, with a significant third-party contribution once again, is set to be revealed as early as this week after taking some time to get over the line. It will take him through until the 2027 World Cup.

until the 2027 World Cup
Even older, slower, less distance on kicks, more hospital passes than a lawyer chasing an ambulance, go ahead BB, prove me wrong!

@Bovidae said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

It will take him through until the 2027 World Cup

If true, seems that Robertson sees him as integral to his plans to go one better than this year's model and win the Final.

@nostrildamus 100% agree. BB should've ridden off into the sunset after RWC2019, but chose to set the ABs back quite a few years at the 10 and 15 positions. Now he's gonna be at 10 for a few years way past his prime.

An often overlooked strength of the ABs (compared to say SA, AU's, etc.) has been that they had stars who knew when they should retire from international rugby. BB is going the opposite route.

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@Bovidae said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

It will take him through until the 2027 World Cup

If true, seems that Robertson sees him as integral to his plans to go one better than this year's model and win the Final.

Maybe he thinks he can get a sweeter tune out of him. Doesn't mean to say he will hitch his wagon to him for the entire 4 years. We will see

@Punch_up said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

Now he's gonna be at 10 for a few years way past his prime.

I'm not sure that's what this signing means. Even not for the Blues.
I can imagine that Robertson considers him useful for a transition period of 1 or 2 years and that BB has negotiated well to get a longer contract. A signing through to 2027 doesn't necessarily mean he'll be an AB for that long.
We'll see.

@canefan Reading my mind. Even the wording :beaming_face_with_smiling_eyes:

@canefan said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@Bovidae said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

It will take him through until the 2027 World Cup

If true, seems that Robertson sees him as integral to his plans to go one better than this year's model and win the Final.

Maybe he thinks he can get a sweeter tune out of him. Doesn't mean to say he will hitch his wagon to him for the entire 4 years. We will see

It makes sense to use him for a year or two but maybe not for four.

Julian Savea signed a 4 year deal through to 2019.

It didn't guarantee Savea was at the 2019 RWC.

@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

Julian Savea signed a 4 year deal through to 2019.

It didn't guarantee Savea was at the 2019 RWC.

Yeah, but Savea was young (25) when he signed and arguably the best winger in rugby -BB is neither.

@Stargazer I suspect that even 1 or 2 years is going to be to the detriment of Dmac's game time at 10 but MORE importantly to the Test experience of any new 10. It may even cut the number of players who will run out in the AB 10 jersey prior to RWC2027.

it might also suggest that the coach is not overly confident of finding enough fresh new 10/15s...

@Bovidae It's ok, everybody. Before drafting Barrett's contract, NZR did their due diligence and research about BB's abilities. They felt it unnecessary to review his last few seasons in the AB team, bc on-field play can be so misleading. Instead they consulted reputable and up-to-date sources including allblacks DOT com where they found the following info:

"WITH DEVASTATING SPEED, a laser-like boot and smart game management, Beauden Barrett has been in electrifying form for the All Blacks in recent seasons, winning back-to-back World Rugby Player of the Year Awards in 2016 and 2017."

I guess Wikipedia was down during that particular lunch break.

@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

it might also suggest that the coach is not overly confident of finding enough fresh new 10/15s...

He'll have to develop them then. Has plenty of time and access to all the best players in NZ.

@Victor-Meldrew he was far from both his and THE best when he re-signed.

He had a few great runs in the 2015 RWC though.

@Victor-Meldrew Agreed. It's as if the previous two AB coaching regimes (Shag and the guy whose name may not be spoken) have brainwashed the public and media into believing that 4 years isn't long enough to develop new 10s.

Henry showed that you can use up to FOUR 10s during a regular 4-year cycle and two of them could be new + very different to your 1st choice.

I not sure what problem is, he has got a new contract , I sure Razor etc have their thoughts on what he will be used for in team and for how long. I said before and don't mind saying again, I am pleased he has signed back here. I my opinion for what it's worth the more competition we have for places in ABs is only good for the team.

@Dan54 He played very well at test level this year, and bridges the gap of experience next year. Blues external sponsor paid a lot of the money too - sounds like a good result for the ABs. A lot of talk from the peanut gallery ...

The big loser in this could be Perofeta as the article says that the Blues needed convincing that BB would add value to their squad. They will be competing for the no.10 jersey from 2025.

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

Julian Savea signed a 4 year deal through to 2019.

It didn't guarantee Savea was at the 2019 RWC.

Yeah, but Savea was young (25) when he signed and arguably the best winger in rugby -BB is neither.

And yet despite all this by 2019 Savea gone. So - as I said - just being signed through to the World Cup is no guarantee you will be at the World Cup

I think DMac deserves decent time as the AB 10. He's been seriously good over the last few years.

@KiwiMurph

True, but the point I'm making is the circumstances are very different. A 4 year deal for BB makes less sense

It's a shame that BB isn't rejoining the Hurricanes.

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@KiwiMurph

True, but the point I'm making is the circumstances are very different. A 4 year deal for BB makes less sense

Think you are missing the wider point. Is keeping our best players in New Zealand not a good thing for keeping Super Rugby strong? Even if he isn't still at his peak, he is still a great pro to have playing locally.

I'd trust Razor to make the tough calls, and to use Barrett how he sees fit in the environment. Rightly or wrongly, I think there is every chance Razor backs himself to get Beauden back playing to the best of his abilities as a 10.

@frugby said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@KiwiMurph

True, but the point I'm making is the circumstances are very different. A 4 year deal for BB makes less sense

Think you are missing the wider point. Is keeping our best players in New Zealand not a good thing for keeping Super Rugby strong? Even if he isn't still at his peak, he is still a great pro to have playing locally.

I'd trust Razor to make the tough calls, and to use Barrett how he sees fit in the environment. Rightly or wrongly, I think there is every chance Razor backs himself to get Beauden back playing to the best of his abilities as a 10.

No, not missing the wider point at all. As I've said, have zero problems or concerns with BB being signed up to provide continuity. I will have concerns if Robertson doesn't develop options at 10 & 15 and a 36yr-old BB is the incumbent

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@frugby said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@KiwiMurph

True, but the point I'm making is the circumstances are very different. A 4 year deal for BB makes less sense

Think you are missing the wider point. Is keeping our best players in New Zealand not a good thing for keeping Super Rugby strong? Even if he isn't still at his peak, he is still a great pro to have playing locally.

I'd trust Razor to make the tough calls, and to use Barrett how he sees fit in the environment. Rightly or wrongly, I think there is every chance Razor backs himself to get Beauden back playing to the best of his abilities as a 10.

No, not missing the wider point at all. As I've said, have zero problems or concerns with BB being signed up to provide continuity. I will have concerns if Robertson doesn't develop options at 10 & 15 and a 36yr-old BB is the incumbent

That's such a sweeping statement though. Absolutely possible that Razor gives him a second wind... it's not like he is 36 now, he is 32.

@frugby i guess concern was DC retired at 32/33...and he was still in pretty good form at the time from memory unlike BB who has been patchy for a while...backs just dont generally have that late carrier resurgence like a hooker might, so im thinking why 4 years? why not two?

@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@frugby i guess concern was DC retired at 32/33...and he was still in pretty good form at the time from memory unlike BB who has been patchy for a while...backs just dont generally have that late carrier resurgence like a hooker might, so im thinking why 4 years? why not two?

Because he will still be good for Super Rugby at the very least. As many others have said, just because he is under contract, does not mean he has to play for the All Blacks.

As far as I am concerned, it isn't good to see anyone going overseas.

@frugby but he's been given an AB contract has he not? not just a super one?

@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@frugby but he's been given an AB contract has he not? not just a super one?

There is no real such thing. All the players who play Super Rugby are contracted to NZR. NZR pay the salaries... All Blacks contracts are then worked into one big salary to go with performance bonuses etc.

The contract does not guarantee selection, see J Savea, Dagg in the past.

@frugby what i mean he'll be getting paid the same as last year (or more) when he was a nailed on starter....so paying someone that way when they might not get selected seems poor business

@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@frugby what i mean he'll be getting paid the same as last year (or more) when he was a nailed on starter....so paying someone that way when they might not get selected seems poor business

Yup. But maybe Razor sees more than we do, maybe he has value in a leadership role in the squad, and perhaps he will be the bridge to the third and fourth years of Razor's tenure

@canefan of course, i think everything said is with the caveat of we may be proven wrong, can only base it on what weve seen to date

@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@canefan of course, i think everything said is with the caveat of we may be proven wrong, can only base it on what weve seen to date

But I agree with you about the money. He'll be paid a lot if he ends up missing out on selection at some stage

@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@frugby what i mean he'll be getting paid the same as last year (or more) when he was a nailed on starter....so paying someone that way when they might not get selected seems poor business

Will he? I thought a large part of it was a blues benefactor? Plus I'm pretty sure you only get the big bucks if you get selected and played for the ABs, isn't it? A payout for selection, then per game played?

@Bones That's what I'm thinking, too.

@frugby said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@frugby said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@KiwiMurph

True, but the point I'm making is the circumstances are very different. A 4 year deal for BB makes less sense

Think you are missing the wider point. Is keeping our best players in New Zealand not a good thing for keeping Super Rugby strong? Even if he isn't still at his peak, he is still a great pro to have playing locally.

I'd trust Razor to make the tough calls, and to use Barrett how he sees fit in the environment. Rightly or wrongly, I think there is every chance Razor backs himself to get Beauden back playing to the best of his abilities as a 10.

No, not missing the wider point at all. As I've said, have zero problems or concerns with BB being signed up to provide continuity. I will have concerns if Robertson doesn't develop options at 10 & 15 and a 36yr-old BB is the incumbent

That's such a sweeping statement though. Absolutely possible that Razor gives him a second wind... it's not like he is 36 now, he is 32.

He'll be 36 if Robertson sticks with him until RWC2027. Not even Coach Jesus can wind clocks back

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@frugby said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@frugby said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2024 - no interminable Foster arguments:

@KiwiMurph

True, but the point I'm making is the circumstances are very different. A 4 year deal for BB makes less sense

Think you are missing the wider point. Is keeping our best players in New Zealand not a good thing for keeping Super Rugby strong? Even if he isn't still at his peak, he is still a great pro to have playing locally.

I'd trust Razor to make the tough calls, and to use Barrett how he sees fit in the environment. Rightly or wrongly, I think there is every chance Razor backs himself to get Beauden back playing to the best of his abilities as a 10.

No, not missing the wider point at all. As I've said, have zero problems or concerns with BB being signed up to provide continuity. I will have concerns if Robertson doesn't develop options at 10 & 15 and a 36yr-old BB is the incumbent

That's such a sweeping statement though. Absolutely possible that Razor gives him a second wind... it's not like he is 36 now, he is 32.

He'll be 36 if Robertson sticks with him until RWC2027. Not even Coach Jesus can wind clocks back

Could reinvent himself though. Sexton was 37 at the RWC... I'd imagine Barrett is very disciplined with his lifestyle. We all go on about his whole game being built around pace, but I still say, let's give him a chance playing as a 10 for Razor before passing real judgement.

@frugby Sexton still being there at 37 was a symbol of Ireland's stellar backline development system. He was well past it, covered over by everyone else being so good.