England v All Blacks

I am feeling quite disillusioned with the game right now.

Every time there is a highly anticipated test between Tier 1 sides, I am paranoid that it will be marred by cards that change the course of the game. And more often than not, that is what is happening these days, and it makes for a terrible product.

When you send a player from the field in a game like rugby, arguably the most physically demanding sport in the world, you fundamentally change the trajectory of the match. And for at least 95% of those matches, you change it in favour of the team that ends up with the numerical advantage, which is just self evident.

For this match, my point is not that the ABs would have won if it wasn't for that completely insane YC to Taylor, lord knows this current AB side have well documented (on here at least) issues with coaching, selection and poor periods of play. It's that the ref fundamentally changed the course of the game with that decision, so we simply don't know what the outcome would have been if it had been left to the players to decide. I'm sorry but that's a horseshit product to watch.

The first half was wonderful; England came out of the blocks at a million miles per hour, we weathered the storm then went bang bang in typical AB fashion to take the lead. Then some silly mistakes from the ABs allowed England the opportunity to get back into the match, which they took in superb English fashion with some beautifully executed drop goals to get back within a point. That was a great half of footy to watch and I couldn't wait for half time to be over to see how it played out in the 2nd 40.

Then what happens? The ref and TMO completely ruin the game by sending Codie off the field, making us play a man down for 10 minutes. That's a BIG deal in a game like rugby at the top level, and England made us pay for that by scoring 14 unanswered points and taking all of the momentum (which is hugely important in a dynamic game like rugby).

If they are going to continue to use cards in this way, then it has to be an absolute last resort. Genuine thuggish behaviour, constant cheating at every ruck (far more than what England got a YC for), but really, there just has to be a better way doesn't there? Could they not look at how other sports do it? Administering appropriate punishment to thuggish behaviour or constant cheating without completely ruining the spectacle?

As soon as that YC was given I actually just switched it off in disgust. Yet another fucking game ruined by card obsessed officials. Then I decided to watch to the end just to see if England would choke or not, and to their credit they played very well in the 2nd 40 to close the match out despite their own YC. England are my second team so I am not upset to see them do well, but the game became pretty meaningless to me post the YC as the ref had completely changed the course of the match, again.

I got up at 4am to watch a ref fuck up what was a wonderful game of rugby. I can obviously live with refs making mistakes, that's part and parcel of being human refereeing a fast paced game. But when those mistakes include sending a player from the field, it ruins the game.

I will not be getting up for the Welsh test, and in fact I think I am going to take some time out from watching and commenting on rugby. Nice timing for me with the cricket season starting, but I am just about done with this game until they sort out this absolute mess with cards.

@brodean said in England Vs All Blacks:

LF for me has been very much hit and miss. He does make things happen but he is also a very slopply player in defence, in his handling, and in his discipline. He's arguably the most inaccurate back in the squad. I think whether good outweighs the bad is up for debate.

Because of how Razor has picked the squad - the alternatives dont offer much. Reece, Rieko and ALB are all past it. Which begs the question why they are in the squad at all.

@No-Quarter said in England Vs All Blacks:

I am feeling quite disillusioned with the game right now.

Every time there is a highly anticipated test between Tier 1 sides, I am paranoid that it will be marred by cards that change the course of the game. And more often than not, that is what is happening these days, and it makes for a terrible product.

When you send a player from the field in a game like rugby, arguably the most physically demanding sport in the world, you fundamentally change the trajectory of the match. And for at least 95% of those matches, you change it in favour of the team that ends up with the numerical advantage, which is just self evident.

For this match, my point is not that the ABs would have won if it wasn't for that completely insane YC to Taylor, lord knows this current AB side have well documented (on here at least) issues with coaching, selection and poor periods of play. It's that the ref fundamentally changed the course of the game with that decision, so we simply don't know what the outcome would have been if it had been left to the players to decide. I'm sorry but that's a horseshit product to watch.

The first half was wonderful; England came out of the blocks at a million miles per hour, we weathered the storm then went bang bang in typical AB fashion to take the lead. Then some silly mistakes from the ABs allowed England the opportunity to get back into the match, which they took in superb English fashion with some beautifully executed drop goals to get back within a point. That was a great half of footy to watch and I couldn't wait for half time to be over to see how it played out in the 2nd 40.

Then what happens? The ref and TMO completely ruin the game by sending Codie off the field, making us play a man down for 10 minutes. That's a BIG deal in a game like rugby at the top level, and England made us pay for that by scoring 14 unanswered points and taking all of the momentum (which is hugely important in a dynamic game like rugby).

If they are going to continue to use cards in this way, then it has to be an absolute last resort. Genuine thuggish behaviour, constant cheating at every ruck (far more than what England got a YC for), but really, there just has to be a better way doesn't there? Could they not look at how other sports do it? Administering appropriate punishment to thuggish behaviour or constant cheating without completely ruining the spectacle?

As soon as that YC was given I actually just switched it off in disgust. Yet another fucking game ruined by card obsessed officials. Then I decided to watch to the end just to see if England would choke or not, and to their credit they played very well in the 2nd 40 to close the match out despite their own YC. England are my second team so I am not upset to see them do well, but the game became pretty meaningless to me post the YC as the ref had completely changed the course of the match, again.

I got up at 4am to watch a ref fuck up what was a wonderful game of rugby. I can obviously live with refs making mistakes, that's part and parcel of being human refereeing a fast paced game. But when those mistakes include sending a player from the field, it ruins the game.

I will not be getting up for the Welsh test, and in fact I think I am going to take some time out from watching and commenting on rugby. Nice timing for me with the cricket season starting, but I am just about done with this game until they sort out this absolute mess with cards.

Well said.

It's a double whammy, or maybe correlation is causation, but the Allblacks decline has coincided with the Sport regressing into this current shit show.

It's borderline unwatchable (when I hear "check check" I grit my teeth), and the RWC final had me punching walls.

Im absolutely sick of it.

@No-Quarter said in England Vs All Blacks:

I am feeling quite disillusioned with the game right now.

Every time there is a highly anticipated test between Tier 1 sides, I am paranoid that it will be marred by cards that change the course of the game. And more often than not, that is what is happening these days, and it makes for a terrible product.

When you send a player from the field in a game like rugby, arguably the most physically demanding sport in the world, you fundamentally change the trajectory of the match. And for at least 95% of those matches, you change it in favour of the team that ends up with the numerical advantage, which is just self evident.

For this match, my point is not that the ABs would have won if it wasn't for that completely insane YC to Taylor, lord knows this current AB side have well documented (on here at least) issues with coaching, selection and poor periods of play. It's that the ref fundamentally changed the course of the game with that decision, so we simply don't know what the outcome would have been if it had been left to the players to decide. I'm sorry but that's a horseshit product to watch.

The first half was wonderful; England came out of the blocks at a million miles per hour, we weathered the storm then went bang bang in typical AB fashion to take the lead. Then some silly mistakes from the ABs allowed England the opportunity to get back into the match, which they took in superb English fashion with some beautifully executed drop goals to get back within a point. That was a great half of footy to watch and I couldn't wait for half time to be over to see how it played out in the 2nd 40.

Then what happens? The ref and TMO completely ruin the game by sending Codie off the field, making us play a man down for 10 minutes. That's a BIG deal in a game like rugby at the top level, and England made us pay for that by scoring 14 unanswered points and taking all of the momentum (which is hugely important in a dynamic game like rugby).

If they are going to continue to use cards in this way, then it has to be an absolute last resort. Genuine thuggish behaviour, constant cheating at every ruck (far more than what England got a YC for), but really, there just has to be a better way doesn't there? Could they not look at how other sports do it? Administering appropriate punishment to thuggish behaviour or constant cheating without completely ruining the spectacle?

As soon as that YC was given I actually just switched it off in disgust. Yet another fucking game ruined by card obsessed officials. Then I decided to watch to the end just to see if England would choke or not, and to their credit they played very well in the 2nd 40 to close the match out despite their own YC. England are my second team so I am not upset to see them do well, but the game became pretty meaningless to me post the YC as the ref had completely changed the course of the match, again.

I got up at 4am to watch a ref fuck up what was a wonderful game of rugby. I can obviously live with refs making mistakes, that's part and parcel of being human refereeing a fast paced game. But when those mistakes include sending a player from the field, it ruins the game.

I will not be getting up for the Welsh test, and in fact I think I am going to take some time out from watching and commenting on rugby. Nice timing for me with the cricket season starting, but I am just about done with this game until they sort out this absolute mess with cards.

The yellow was dubious, but it wasn’t definitive. Refereeing was a bit all over the place, as it always will be, but it’s very very clear watching this game that you weren’t the better side.

@Dodge said in England Vs All Blacks:

@No-Quarter said in England Vs All Blacks:

I am feeling quite disillusioned with the game right now.

Every time there is a highly anticipated test between Tier 1 sides, I am paranoid that it will be marred by cards that change the course of the game. And more often than not, that is what is happening these days, and it makes for a terrible product.

When you send a player from the field in a game like rugby, arguably the most physically demanding sport in the world, you fundamentally change the trajectory of the match. And for at least 95% of those matches, you change it in favour of the team that ends up with the numerical advantage, which is just self evident.

For this match, my point is not that the ABs would have won if it wasn't for that completely insane YC to Taylor, lord knows this current AB side have well documented (on here at least) issues with coaching, selection and poor periods of play. It's that the ref fundamentally changed the course of the game with that decision, so we simply don't know what the outcome would have been if it had been left to the players to decide. I'm sorry but that's a horseshit product to watch.

The first half was wonderful; England came out of the blocks at a million miles per hour, we weathered the storm then went bang bang in typical AB fashion to take the lead. Then some silly mistakes from the ABs allowed England the opportunity to get back into the match, which they took in superb English fashion with some beautifully executed drop goals to get back within a point. That was a great half of footy to watch and I couldn't wait for half time to be over to see how it played out in the 2nd 40.

Then what happens? The ref and TMO completely ruin the game by sending Codie off the field, making us play a man down for 10 minutes. That's a BIG deal in a game like rugby at the top level, and England made us pay for that by scoring 14 unanswered points and taking all of the momentum (which is hugely important in a dynamic game like rugby).

If they are going to continue to use cards in this way, then it has to be an absolute last resort. Genuine thuggish behaviour, constant cheating at every ruck (far more than what England got a YC for), but really, there just has to be a better way doesn't there? Could they not look at how other sports do it? Administering appropriate punishment to thuggish behaviour or constant cheating without completely ruining the spectacle?

As soon as that YC was given I actually just switched it off in disgust. Yet another fucking game ruined by card obsessed officials. Then I decided to watch to the end just to see if England would choke or not, and to their credit they played very well in the 2nd 40 to close the match out despite their own YC. England are my second team so I am not upset to see them do well, but the game became pretty meaningless to me post the YC as the ref had completely changed the course of the match, again.

I got up at 4am to watch a ref fuck up what was a wonderful game of rugby. I can obviously live with refs making mistakes, that's part and parcel of being human refereeing a fast paced game. But when those mistakes include sending a player from the field, it ruins the game.

I will not be getting up for the Welsh test, and in fact I think I am going to take some time out from watching and commenting on rugby. Nice timing for me with the cricket season starting, but I am just about done with this game until they sort out this absolute mess with cards.

The yellow was dubious, but it wasn’t definitive. Refereeing was a bit all over the place, as it always will be, but it’s very very clear watching this game that you weren’t the better side.

None of my post was about whether the ABs were the better side, or even deserved to win, so I'm not sure why you have commented on that. And I actually thought the ref did a great job overall.

The TLDR of my post is that if we use cards the way we do today, it leaves it open to the ref making a single mistake and ruining the game as a result. That's not even fair on the ref, let alone the players and paying fans. It's absurd.

@Dodge said in England Vs All Blacks:

@No-Quarter said in England Vs All Blacks:

I am feeling quite disillusioned with the game right now.

Every time there is a highly anticipated test between Tier 1 sides, I am paranoid that it will be marred by cards that change the course of the game. And more often than not, that is what is happening these days, and it makes for a terrible product.

When you send a player from the field in a game like rugby, arguably the most physically demanding sport in the world, you fundamentally change the trajectory of the match. And for at least 95% of those matches, you change it in favour of the team that ends up with the numerical advantage, which is just self evident.

For this match, my point is not that the ABs would have won if it wasn't for that completely insane YC to Taylor, lord knows this current AB side have well documented (on here at least) issues with coaching, selection and poor periods of play. It's that the ref fundamentally changed the course of the game with that decision, so we simply don't know what the outcome would have been if it had been left to the players to decide. I'm sorry but that's a horseshit product to watch.

The first half was wonderful; England came out of the blocks at a million miles per hour, we weathered the storm then went bang bang in typical AB fashion to take the lead. Then some silly mistakes from the ABs allowed England the opportunity to get back into the match, which they took in superb English fashion with some beautifully executed drop goals to get back within a point. That was a great half of footy to watch and I couldn't wait for half time to be over to see how it played out in the 2nd 40.

Then what happens? The ref and TMO completely ruin the game by sending Codie off the field, making us play a man down for 10 minutes. That's a BIG deal in a game like rugby at the top level, and England made us pay for that by scoring 14 unanswered points and taking all of the momentum (which is hugely important in a dynamic game like rugby).

If they are going to continue to use cards in this way, then it has to be an absolute last resort. Genuine thuggish behaviour, constant cheating at every ruck (far more than what England got a YC for), but really, there just has to be a better way doesn't there? Could they not look at how other sports do it? Administering appropriate punishment to thuggish behaviour or constant cheating without completely ruining the spectacle?

As soon as that YC was given I actually just switched it off in disgust. Yet another fucking game ruined by card obsessed officials. Then I decided to watch to the end just to see if England would choke or not, and to their credit they played very well in the 2nd 40 to close the match out despite their own YC. England are my second team so I am not upset to see them do well, but the game became pretty meaningless to me post the YC as the ref had completely changed the course of the match, again.

I got up at 4am to watch a ref fuck up what was a wonderful game of rugby. I can obviously live with refs making mistakes, that's part and parcel of being human refereeing a fast paced game. But when those mistakes include sending a player from the field, it ruins the game.

I will not be getting up for the Welsh test, and in fact I think I am going to take some time out from watching and commenting on rugby. Nice timing for me with the cricket season starting, but I am just about done with this game until they sort out this absolute mess with cards.

The yellow was dubious, but it wasn’t definitive. Refereeing was a bit all over the place, as it always will be, but it’s very very clear watching this game that you weren’t the better side.

The best teams dont always win. You can be on the ropes and get a plucky win.

What no quarter is saying is that the butterfly effect of these frivolous cards is changing the course of history and we will never really know.

It didn’t ruin the game is my point. Don’t do it. Sometimes the ref will ping you. (Same goes for Earl).

@Dodge said in England Vs All Blacks:

It didn’t ruin the game is my point. Don’t do it. Sometimes the ref will ping you. (Same goes for Earl).

Could not disagree more. Cards have been ruining games for years now and I am sick of it.

@Gunner said in England Vs All Blacks:

Beauden Barrett, not once but twice, fucking TWICE missing touch

In BB's defence it was ONCE ... (once too many). Roigard fucked up the second one.

Which points fo the fact BB was injured, and should have been hooked.

@canefan said in England Vs All Blacks:

@KiwiMurph said in England Vs All Blacks:

@canefan said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Canes4life said in England Vs All Blacks:

Who does everyone want to see start at 10 next week for Beau-Done Barrett?

I think it’s time to give Ruben some love. We don’t learn anything starting DMac.

I don't want Love exposed to starting. DMac to start, Reuben to get at least 30 minutes at either 10 or as a 15 double pivot. The boy needs to play, and 15 should be just as up for grabs as 10. WJ can move to wing and be effective

Worried about exposed to starting? Against Wales? Has conservative Razor infiltrated your account?

Fozzie used to do stuff like that. Put a reserve on to start with a bunch of other reserves, and watch them fail

You are learning nothing with Love playing from the bench vs Wales

If you want to give him 30 minutes at 10 then either start him at 10 and shift him to 15 or visca versca

@No-Quarter said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Dodge said in England Vs All Blacks:

It didn’t ruin the game is my point. Don’t do it. Sometimes the ref will ping you. (Same goes for Earl).

Could not disagree more. Cards have been ruining games for years now and I am sick of it.

Obviously you didn’t see Earl’s as you turned it off in disgust.

@Gunner said in England Vs All Blacks:

And why the fuck are we taking taps from penalties 40m out?

Because our hooker was off and we hadn't been able to replace him as there hadn't been a scrum.

Again, why we hadn't considered the possibility of this and taught Ardie or Lakai to throw to some sort of option is also on the coaching staff.

@Dodge can you please go and read my whole post before commenting

@Dodge said in England Vs All Blacks:

It didn’t ruin the game is my point. Don’t do it. Sometimes the ref will ping you. (Same goes for Earl).

He didnt do anything. Watch it in full speed. It wasn't even in our own 22.

If thats a yellow you may turn it into ice hockey and have a revolving door of sin bins.

We are not far off as it is.

@booboo said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Gunner said in England Vs All Blacks:

And why the fuck are we taking taps from penalties 40m out?

Because our hooker was off and we hadn't been able to replace him as there hadn't been a scrum.

Again, why we hadn't considered the possibility of this and taught Ardie or Lakai to throw to some sort of option is also on the coaching staff.

Rassie had Kolbe upskilled to line out throw.

@booboo said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Gunner said in England Vs All Blacks:

Beauden Barrett, not once but twice, fucking TWICE missing touch

In BB's defence it was ONCE ... (once too many). Roigard fucked up the second one.

Which points fo the fact BB was injured, and should have been hooked.

Beaudy did it twice no? Then Roigard did it too.

@No-Quarter said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Dodge can you please go and read my whole post before commenting

I read the whole post. I don’t agree with you. Cards are an important part of stopping cheating pricks being cheating pricks. Just like every other decision they’re sometimes not right.

If you think the cards ruined this game then I might respectfully suggest that you’re just a bitter AB fan dreaming of the old days.

@booboo said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Gunner said in England Vs All Blacks:

And why the fuck are we taking taps from penalties 40m out?

Because our hooker was off and we hadn't been able to replace him as there hadn't been a scrum.

Again, why we hadn't considered the possibility of this and taught Ardie or Lakai to throw to some sort of option is also on the coaching staff.

They could have brought Samisoni on at the lineout - it just means he would have stayed on the rest of the game

Which begs the question why is Razor so afraid to bring Samisoni on early (and not that early - it was the second half after all)

Razor has a real history of playing certain players into the ground for both the Crusaders and the ABs.

They were trying to be too cute and paid the price.

I'll read through the thread soon but did mention previously that sooner or later the ABs would be too far behind for the impact players to have a positive effect on the outcome of the game. It worked against Ireland and then Scotland but that's no plan for success.

There are no excuses for Robertson to continue starting BB from here on. Again, injury might end up being the best selector, so let's see DMac at 10 and Love at 15 against Wales.

@Dodge said in England Vs All Blacks:

@No-Quarter said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Dodge can you please go and read my whole post before commenting

I read the whole post. I don’t agree with you. Cards are an important part of stopping cheating pricks being cheating pricks. Just like every other decision they’re sometimes not right.

If you think the cards ruined this game then I might respectfully suggest that you’re just a bitter AB fan dreaming of the old days.

Not responding to obvious bait. If you won't engage in a serious discussion then I won't either.

@Jet said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Dodge said in England Vs All Blacks:

It didn’t ruin the game is my point. Don’t do it. Sometimes the ref will ping you. (Same goes for Earl).

He didnt do anything. Watch it in full speed. It wasn't even in our own 22.

If thats a yellow you may turn it into ice hockey and have a revolving door of sin bins.

We are not far off as it is.

I didn’t say it was yellow, I said the yellow wasn’t definitive and it didn’t ruin the game.

@Dodge said in England Vs All Blacks:

It didn’t ruin the game is my point. Don’t do it. Sometimes the ref will ping you. (Same goes for Earl).

Two things for me

1. The constant TMO intervention must be a pain for the refs, and picking through the minutiae of every piece of play isn't helping improve the game itself
2. We should be good enough to overcome a YC. The saffas are highly capable of this right now, but we don't appear to have the strong on field leadership required to shut it down for 10 minutes

@canefan said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Dodge said in England Vs All Blacks:

It didn’t ruin the game is my point. Don’t do it. Sometimes the ref will ping you. (Same goes for Earl).

Two things for me

1. The constant TMO intervention must be a pain for the refs, and picking through the minutiae of every piece of play isn't helping improve the game itself
2. We should be good enough to overcome a YC. The saffas are highly capable of this right now, but we don't appear to have the strong on field leadership required to shut it down for 10 minutes

TMO is a more interesting question to me, as the offside at the lineout before George Ford’s try was picked up by the TMO but not on the field. Fair enough, but where do you start and stop. Ultimately I’m of the view that good decisions made badly are better than bad decisions made live but it’s a balance (and bad decisions will be made in either situation). Rugby fans will whinge either way, it’s not cricket

@Jet really? We missed 3?

I think it was a massive blow for us losing Fabian Holland in the build up to this test. As it was losing Patrick Tuipolotu before the tour when he was in career best form.

Our locks/engine room were really undersized again in this match as it was Vs SA in Wellington and their scrum and carrying game suffered as a result.

Our locks moving forward should be big men who can provide guaranteed go forward Holland, Darry and Tuipolotu. While Lord played alright he is a bit of a Jason Eaton, Dodie Weir bean pole, if selected it he should only be partnered with a really big man.

Imo Scott Barrett and Tupou Vaai need to have really strong Super rugby seasons at blind side in order to be picked to play internationally from now on.

In fact New Zealand rugby should put out a etiquette for NZ Super rugby sides that no one under 195 centimeters is allowed to play six in Super rugby anymore.

Josh Beehre and Cameron Christie should be 6 for the Blues
Tupoui Vaai and Naitoa Ah Kuoi. should be 6 for the Chiefs
Caleb Delaney and Tom Allen should be 6 for the Chiefs
Scott Barrett and Jamie Hannah should be 6 for the Crusaders
Tk Howdens, Will Stoddard or Oli Haig should be 6 for the Highlanders.

Watching back now.

Could the TMO fuck off?

@Steven-Harris said in England Vs All Blacks:

@BorderJB the one thing i will say about Ardie and did wonder about this during the Super season , how much petrol would he have in the tank come the back end of the season?
He looks absolutely shattered i personally think their were games that either Du Plessis Kirifi and or Peter Lakai could have started in the 7 jersey
Fair to say having Scooter injured did not help and that meant having Ardie pick up the captains role but if i have one issue with this coaching group , we select players but never play them Kirifi and Love are classic case in point

Du Plesis Kirifi and Leroy Carter are too small and not players who can succeed longterm in test match rugby with the physicality it demands. Both were poor selection for this tour especially Kirifi who was already found out in the Rugby Championship.

Also: if Codie Taylor deserves a yellow card there, you're going to empty the field pretty quickly...

Time to reset expectations boys, we are just an ordinary football side. We don't do anything well, our so-called stars and leaders are just complete non-entities. I submit for consideration that without Cam Roigard we would have lost at least one more test this year.

England were better than us at everything bar the set piece, which was our only shining light today. Their loose forwards bitched ours, their backs were far more threatening, Ford controlled the game beautifully.

What the fuck is our defence? We have no line speed, we don't hit with hard shoulders, and we lose our connections so very quickly. Appalling.

What was our phase plan? Ok hit the blind. But we pass to a guy who has retreated to get in position. And thus no momentum. Poor lakai tried his guts out but he's too small to be used like that. Slow ball to slow ball to slow ball to shit kick. Or wide cut out and hope our winger can run over 5 blokes.

If that performance isn't the end of beaudens career then we are not serious about winning. Absolutely dog shit in everything he did. And DMac wasn't much better, but at least he can find touch.

Savea and Parker were anonymous, absolutely bitched by Earl. Who exactly are our difference makers? God we're so mid.

I'm not even mad, I'm just... I don't know, underwhelmed

We're shit, we're going nowhere,

Congrats England. Outplayed us after the first 15-20 minutes. I was never confident going into this match, and I woke up this morning to see my Saffa mate was messaging me, he only does that when the ABs lose, so while I ignored the messages I was fully prepped for the loss.

Why do the ABs even bother to kick up and unders, we’re the worst team at contesting them.

How do you stuff up two penalty clearances BB? @booboo Are you claiming Roigard kicked one of them? I don’t want to do a rewatch, so hopefully someone else can confirm.

Does anyone else get annoyed that halfbacks drag a ball back through a ruck with their hands and it's seemingly fine?

Another week where Jordan’s basic passing skills are shown up. How is he so good at the rest of the game. Was he always sick when they did up and down the field passing drills at school?

The AB’s inability to bring down Lawerance in the first half directly led to the try in the second, which is not to absolve QT of a bloody poor defensive read. In fact our out wide defence from 13-15 looked shaky all night. LF was coming in during the first half like he was DWZ at the Warriors.

Funniest thing was Justin Marshall saying how a team of the ABs stature can recover a deficit in 5 minutes. Yeah, not this AB team Justin.

I think the biggest issues I have is with our passiveness in both attack and defence. In attack we just seem to form up to hit the defenders and set the ruck, we’re not looking to punch through. In defence we seem to wait for attackers to come to us and it means that they’re always going over the advantage line which opens up more space on the next attack.

I like Pollack’s energy. He was great during the haka. His energy is like Itoje except likeable.

And in yet another episode of World Rugby hates rugby. How do you give a yellow card for a 50/50 call nowhere near in the attacking zone. The issue with it is that so many other small incidents happen in the game that could draw penalties/cards and don’t. In this game alone players were playing the ball on the ground, tackling on the ground, not using the arms in tackles, where was the TMO then?

And no, Earl rightfully getting carded for pulling down a maul doesn’t have any relevance to the Taylor card.

Also, pointing out inconsistent and problematic card decisions is not bitterness. Commenting and criticising on all aspects of a match is the lifeblood of this forum and the majority of it is directed at our players and coaches - any poster who thinks otherwise is not paying attention. Suggesting we reserve our criticism of contentious reffing decisions because our team lost is fucking stupid.

@NTA said in England Vs All Blacks:

Also: if Codie Taylor deserves a yellow card there, you're going to empty the field pretty quickly...

If Codie walked, then Itoje has to go for playing Scooter in the air and slapping the ball out 8 years from their own line.

@KiwiMurph said in England Vs All Blacks:

@brodean said in England Vs All Blacks:

LF for me has been very much hit and miss. He does make things happen but he is also a very slopply player in defence, in his handling, and in his discipline. He's arguably the most inaccurate back in the squad. I think whether good outweighs the bad is up for debate.

Because of how Razor has picked the squad - the alternatives dont offer much. Reece, Rieko and ALB are all past it. Which begs the question why they are in the squad at all.

Aside from QT in one test no 13 has shown they're decisively a better option than Rieko. They're all supposed to be better attackers/passers yet none of them has proved that.

Agree on Reece and ALB though.

@mariner4life I've maintained for a while that NZ Rugby is about 10-15 years behind Australia in terms of systems failure.

It'll probably be accelerated by the nature of Super Rugby as the Australian teams get weaker.

@Nepia said in England Vs All Blacks:

Also, pointing out inconsistent and problematic card decisions is not bitterness. Commenting and criticising on all aspects of a match is the lifeblood of this forum and the majority of it is directed at our players and coaches - any poster who thinks otherwise is not paying attention. Suggesting we reserve our criticism of contentious reffing decisions because our team lost is fucking stupid.

I’m going to go out on a limb and assume this is aimed at me. If not, you can ignore the rest of this message. I didn’t say pointing out a yellow isn’t a yellow isn’t ok, i didn’t say you couldn’t criticise the decision. I didn’t even disagree that it wasn’t a yellow. I said it didn’t ruin (and would add, didn’t decide) the game.

@Jet said in England Vs All Blacks:

@NTA said in England Vs All Blacks:

Also: if Codie Taylor deserves a yellow card there, you're going to empty the field pretty quickly...

If Codie walked, then Itoje has to go for playing Scooter in the air and slapping the ball out 8 years from their own line.

Itoje deserved about 3 yellow cards if cynical offences are a straight yellow.

And about 5 for screaming like a bitch at lineout time.

Opposition teams should line someone adjacent to him at lineout and just scream at him. Fire with Fire

Keep in mind Codie got a yellow, for our first penalty in the game. Near the halfway line.

@Jet said in England Vs All Blacks:

Keep in mind Codie got a yellow, for our first penalty in the game. Near the halfway line.

Blatant red if you ask me

@Dodge said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Jet said in England Vs All Blacks:

Keep in mind Codie got a yellow, for our first penalty in the game. Near the halfway line.

Blatant red if you ask me

The foul play TMO says that will cost you a gold watch...

This is leadership.

@ACT-Crusader said in England Vs All Blacks:

@sparky said in England Vs All Blacks:

@Tim Nope. That was 2012.

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Nooo that must be some AI. That says the ABs had Jane and Nonu, Conrad and McCaw, Mealamu and Whitelock. And this was Hansen basically photocopying Henry’s playbook. I thought they were ruthless and calm and well coached.

Tuilagi and Barrit ripped us a new one that night.

TBF that was a one off extremely bad performance that is still talked about today because of how inept we were (especially at defending the overstayer). Whereas today's performance is not even the worst of this season.