Boks tour squad

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@frugby said in Boks tour squad:

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@frugby said in Boks tour squad:

@Chris said in Boks tour squad:

@pakman said in Boks tour squad:

Aotearoa Pod confidently talking about 44 players.
27/17 split?

I am picking a 26/18 split

4 hookers
8 props
6 locks
8 loose forwards
4 HBs
3 1st fives
5 centres
4 wings
2 FBs

a couple of utilities in the backs.

Hookers: C Taylor, Taukei'aho, Aumua, G Bell (J Taylor next cab)
Props: de Groot, Numia, Norris, Tu'ungafasi, Newell, Tosi, Lomax, Ta'avao (Williams injured?)
Locks: Holland, S Barrett, Lord, Vaa'i, Darry, Tuipulotu (Ah Kuoi next cab)
Loose Forwards: Parker, Savea, Lakai, Sititi, Kirifi, Jacobson, Lio-Willie, Segner (Think there is room for a massive bolter here + Frizell if available)
Halfbacks: Roigard, Ratima, Hotham, Christie
First Fives: McKenzie, Perofeta, Love
Midfielders: Tupaea, J Barrett, Ioane, A Lienert-Brown, Procter
Wingers: Clarke, Tangitau, Carter, Narawa
Fullbacks: Jordan, B Barrett

I've gone with the below: Mafileo over Ta'avao, B Barrett at 10 over Perofeta, Harkin as a 15, Preston instead of Christie, Fainganuku instead of Ioane as a centre, Ioane to the wing, Beehre in as a lock/6, Bower over Tu'ungafasi

Hookers: C Taylor, Taukei'aho, Aumua, G Bell
Props: de Groot, Numia, Norris, Bower, Newell, Tosi, Lomax, Mafileo
Locks: Holland, S Barrett, Lord, Vaa'i, Darry, Tuipulotu, Beehre
Loose Forwards: Parker, Savea, Lakai, Sititi, Kirifi, Jacobson, Lio-Willie, Segner
Halfbacks: Roigard, Ratima, Hotham, Preston
First Fives: McKenzie, B Barrett, Love
Midfielders: Tupaea, J Barrett, Proctor, Fainganuku, Leinert-Brown
Wingers: Clarke, Tangitau, Ioane, Narawa, Carter
Fullbacks: Jordan, C Harkin

Forgot about Mafileo… think people are sleeping on Perofeta. I see them picking Sullivan before Harkin.

Harkin a good wee player, but he absolutely reeks to me of a guy who is playing above his station because he has great players around him and is in a good system. Need more at test level.

I don't get the hype around Sullivan, big boot yes, not too bad under the high ball, but his attacking game is a bit meh. His brother is definitely superior in that regard.

Sullivan has been more consistent this year than he ever has before… and his game in theory translates nicely to the test rugby.

Dominant in the air, dominant boot.

@frugby said in Boks tour squad:

@Chris said in Boks tour squad:

Mounga will be in that squad.

*If available

He will be and Frizell

@Chris Think you’re right.

@frugby said in Boks tour squad:

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@frugby said in Boks tour squad:

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@frugby said in Boks tour squad:

@Chris said in Boks tour squad:

@pakman said in Boks tour squad:

Aotearoa Pod confidently talking about 44 players.
27/17 split?

I am picking a 26/18 split

4 hookers
8 props
6 locks
8 loose forwards
4 HBs
3 1st fives
5 centres
4 wings
2 FBs

a couple of utilities in the backs.

Hookers: C Taylor, Taukei'aho, Aumua, G Bell (J Taylor next cab)
Props: de Groot, Numia, Norris, Tu'ungafasi, Newell, Tosi, Lomax, Ta'avao (Williams injured?)
Locks: Holland, S Barrett, Lord, Vaa'i, Darry, Tuipulotu (Ah Kuoi next cab)
Loose Forwards: Parker, Savea, Lakai, Sititi, Kirifi, Jacobson, Lio-Willie, Segner (Think there is room for a massive bolter here + Frizell if available)
Halfbacks: Roigard, Ratima, Hotham, Christie
First Fives: McKenzie, Perofeta, Love
Midfielders: Tupaea, J Barrett, Ioane, A Lienert-Brown, Procter
Wingers: Clarke, Tangitau, Carter, Narawa
Fullbacks: Jordan, B Barrett

I've gone with the below: Mafileo over Ta'avao, B Barrett at 10 over Perofeta, Harkin as a 15, Preston instead of Christie, Fainganuku instead of Ioane as a centre, Ioane to the wing, Beehre in as a lock/6, Bower over Tu'ungafasi

Hookers: C Taylor, Taukei'aho, Aumua, G Bell
Props: de Groot, Numia, Norris, Bower, Newell, Tosi, Lomax, Mafileo
Locks: Holland, S Barrett, Lord, Vaa'i, Darry, Tuipulotu, Beehre
Loose Forwards: Parker, Savea, Lakai, Sititi, Kirifi, Jacobson, Lio-Willie, Segner
Halfbacks: Roigard, Ratima, Hotham, Preston
First Fives: McKenzie, B Barrett, Love
Midfielders: Tupaea, J Barrett, Proctor, Fainganuku, Leinert-Brown
Wingers: Clarke, Tangitau, Ioane, Narawa, Carter
Fullbacks: Jordan, C Harkin

Forgot about Mafileo… think people are sleeping on Perofeta. I see them picking Sullivan before Harkin.

Harkin a good wee player, but he absolutely reeks to me of a guy who is playing above his station because he has great players around him and is in a good system. Need more at test level.

I don't get the hype around Sullivan, big boot yes, not too bad under the high ball, but his attacking game is a bit meh. His brother is definitely superior in that regard.

Sullivan has been more consistent this year than he ever has before… and his game in theory translates nicely to the test rugby.

Dominant in the air, dominant boot.

I agree, those are two skills necessary for the test arena, but if we want the ABs to hum again, we need more than that. Sullivan needs to be able to pull trigger on attack when the opportunity presents itself, to me he's not that sort of fullback yet. Happy to be proven wrong over the remaining weeks of Super.

On the other hand we have someone like Jordan who is fully established but has a woeful kicking game. Will depend on the style of rugby Rennie wants to play.

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@Chris said in Boks tour squad:

Those teams speculated on further up the thread look a lot like rinse and repeat from the last 3 years.
I am not sure the results are going to be much better with the same players.

We have no choice to go with similar players to previous years because all the talent playing well in Super Rugby right now are leaving because they weren't selected in previous seasons.

Aside from Frizzell and Mo'unga, who would you have in there?

Yeah a major problem your side is close to what I would like to see.

Mounga for Harkin
Frizell for Jacobsen
Gardiner could be looked at
Probably not a lot else when I look.

Really there are too many players not up to it we have to select which is my worry.
The SA tour could be brutal as far as results go.

@Chris said in Boks tour squad:

Frizell for Jacobsen

Not competing for the same position. I'd be taking Jacobson as a 7 ahead of Kirifi.

Kirifi and Lakai will be under pressure to make early squads .

@Chris said in Boks tour squad:

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@Chris said in Boks tour squad:

Those teams speculated on further up the thread look a lot like rinse and repeat from the last 3 years.
I am not sure the results are going to be much better with the same players.

We have no choice to go with similar players to previous years because all the talent playing well in Super Rugby right now are leaving because they weren't selected in previous seasons.

Aside from Frizzell and Mo'unga, who would you have in there?

Yeah a major problem your side is close to what I would like to see.

Mounga for Harkin
Frizell for Jacobsen
Gardiner could be looked at
Probably not a lot else when I look.

Really there are too many players not up to it we have to select which is my worry.
The SA tour could be brutal as far as results go.

If Mo'unga is available this might be an unpopular opinion, but I'd take Harkin over BB.

If the ultimate goal is to prepare our players for the WC next year, then why take someone who's going to be even further over the hill in 18 months time.

Hmmm, Gardiner isn't imposing enough for an AB eight. Definitely the key ingredient this AB side is missing.

Assuming they don't have their eye on another colour jersey at international level, id be picking any form player, regardless of whether they play abroad next season or not.

This tour is as much about development and getting points on the board for restoring confidence.

@george33 said in Boks tour squad:

Kirifi and Lakai will be under pressure to make early squads .

I didn't realise your source was Rennie himself.

You're making statements like these decisions have been made. We all know AB coaches don't make big selection calls until they've seen players under stress in the playoffs.

The thing I don't get with New Zealand Rugby, the previous coaching group, media, fans etc. is this over fixation on beating the Springboks. Yes it's important, but we shouldn't be selecting a whole squad to counter just them.

What happened to picking the right players to play our brand of footy? Heck, if we get it right, the Boks should be the ones worrying.

@Chris said in Boks tour squad:

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@Chris said in Boks tour squad:

Those teams speculated on further up the thread look a lot like rinse and repeat from the last 3 years.
I am not sure the results are going to be much better with the same players.

We have no choice to go with similar players to previous years because all the talent playing well in Super Rugby right now are leaving because they weren't selected in previous seasons.

Aside from Frizzell and Mo'unga, who would you have in there?

Yeah a major problem your side is close to what I would like to see.

Mounga for Harkin
Frizell for Jacobsen
Gardiner could be looked at
Probably not a lot else when I look.

Really there are too many players not up to it we have to select which is my worry.
The SA tour could be brutal as far as results go.

This squad is going to be so big that it is absolutely going to contain almost all of the same old players, plus a few new ones - it's more about the 23 on the field and the gameplan where we can hope for major changes.

i find the Frizzell love so weird, i copped so much flack back before i saw the light, 99% of people thought he was rubbish in the black jersey and were desperate to see him dropped...and now we think a few years playing in Japan will have made him better prepared to face the Bokke?

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@frugby said in Boks tour squad:

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@frugby said in Boks tour squad:

@Chris said in Boks tour squad:

@pakman said in Boks tour squad:

Aotearoa Pod confidently talking about 44 players.
27/17 split?

I am picking a 26/18 split

4 hookers
8 props
6 locks
8 loose forwards
4 HBs
3 1st fives
5 centres
4 wings
2 FBs

a couple of utilities in the backs.

Hookers: C Taylor, Taukei'aho, Aumua, G Bell (J Taylor next cab)
Props: de Groot, Numia, Norris, Tu'ungafasi, Newell, Tosi, Lomax, Ta'avao (Williams injured?)
Locks: Holland, S Barrett, Lord, Vaa'i, Darry, Tuipulotu (Ah Kuoi next cab)
Loose Forwards: Parker, Savea, Lakai, Sititi, Kirifi, Jacobson, Lio-Willie, Segner (Think there is room for a massive bolter here + Frizell if available)
Halfbacks: Roigard, Ratima, Hotham, Christie
First Fives: McKenzie, Perofeta, Love
Midfielders: Tupaea, J Barrett, Ioane, A Lienert-Brown, Procter
Wingers: Clarke, Tangitau, Carter, Narawa
Fullbacks: Jordan, B Barrett

I've gone with the below: Mafileo over Ta'avao, B Barrett at 10 over Perofeta, Harkin as a 15, Preston instead of Christie, Fainganuku instead of Ioane as a centre, Ioane to the wing, Beehre in as a lock/6, Bower over Tu'ungafasi

Hookers: C Taylor, Taukei'aho, Aumua, G Bell
Props: de Groot, Numia, Norris, Bower, Newell, Tosi, Lomax, Mafileo
Locks: Holland, S Barrett, Lord, Vaa'i, Darry, Tuipulotu, Beehre
Loose Forwards: Parker, Savea, Lakai, Sititi, Kirifi, Jacobson, Lio-Willie, Segner
Halfbacks: Roigard, Ratima, Hotham, Preston
First Fives: McKenzie, B Barrett, Love
Midfielders: Tupaea, J Barrett, Proctor, Fainganuku, Leinert-Brown
Wingers: Clarke, Tangitau, Ioane, Narawa, Carter
Fullbacks: Jordan, C Harkin

Forgot about Mafileo… think people are sleeping on Perofeta. I see them picking Sullivan before Harkin.

Harkin a good wee player, but he absolutely reeks to me of a guy who is playing above his station because he has great players around him and is in a good system. Need more at test level.

I don't get the hype around Sullivan, big boot yes, not too bad under the high ball, but his attacking game is a bit meh. His brother is definitely superior in that regard.

i think the way i see this kind of thing is, are there other that can spark attack?....yes....would a big boot be a benefit and something we haven't had in abundance...yes...so would be a net improvement

@Kiwiwomble said in Boks tour squad:

i find the Frizzell love so weird, i copped so much flack back before i saw the light, 99% of people thought he was rubbish in the black jersey and were desperate to see him dropped...and now we think a few years playing in Japan will have made him better prepared to face the Bokke?

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@frugby said in Boks tour squad:

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@frugby said in Boks tour squad:

@Chris said in Boks tour squad:

@pakman said in Boks tour squad:

Aotearoa Pod confidently talking about 44 players.
27/17 split?

I am picking a 26/18 split

4 hookers
8 props
6 locks
8 loose forwards
4 HBs
3 1st fives
5 centres
4 wings
2 FBs

a couple of utilities in the backs.

Hookers: C Taylor, Taukei'aho, Aumua, G Bell (J Taylor next cab)
Props: de Groot, Numia, Norris, Tu'ungafasi, Newell, Tosi, Lomax, Ta'avao (Williams injured?)
Locks: Holland, S Barrett, Lord, Vaa'i, Darry, Tuipulotu (Ah Kuoi next cab)
Loose Forwards: Parker, Savea, Lakai, Sititi, Kirifi, Jacobson, Lio-Willie, Segner (Think there is room for a massive bolter here + Frizell if available)
Halfbacks: Roigard, Ratima, Hotham, Christie
First Fives: McKenzie, Perofeta, Love
Midfielders: Tupaea, J Barrett, Ioane, A Lienert-Brown, Procter
Wingers: Clarke, Tangitau, Carter, Narawa
Fullbacks: Jordan, B Barrett

I've gone with the below: Mafileo over Ta'avao, B Barrett at 10 over Perofeta, Harkin as a 15, Preston instead of Christie, Fainganuku instead of Ioane as a centre, Ioane to the wing, Beehre in as a lock/6, Bower over Tu'ungafasi

Hookers: C Taylor, Taukei'aho, Aumua, G Bell
Props: de Groot, Numia, Norris, Bower, Newell, Tosi, Lomax, Mafileo
Locks: Holland, S Barrett, Lord, Vaa'i, Darry, Tuipulotu, Beehre
Loose Forwards: Parker, Savea, Lakai, Sititi, Kirifi, Jacobson, Lio-Willie, Segner
Halfbacks: Roigard, Ratima, Hotham, Preston
First Fives: McKenzie, B Barrett, Love
Midfielders: Tupaea, J Barrett, Proctor, Fainganuku, Leinert-Brown
Wingers: Clarke, Tangitau, Ioane, Narawa, Carter
Fullbacks: Jordan, C Harkin

Forgot about Mafileo… think people are sleeping on Perofeta. I see them picking Sullivan before Harkin.

Harkin a good wee player, but he absolutely reeks to me of a guy who is playing above his station because he has great players around him and is in a good system. Need more at test level.

I don't get the hype around Sullivan, big boot yes, not too bad under the high ball, but his attacking game is a bit meh. His brother is definitely superior in that regard.

i think the way i see this kind of thing is, are there other that can spark attack?....yes....would a big boot be a benefit and something we haven't had in abundance...yes...so would be a net improvement

That's why I would have Harkin over Sullivan, he has a very solid boot, strong under the high ball, but what he's really been good at this year is accelerating to the line (sometimes through it) and putting his wingers away. Moorby and Fineanganofo have been made to look even better because of what Harkin's brought at the back.

If they go with Sullivan, at least he'll be an improvement on the aging BB.

If you go for Zarn at 15, that would suggest quite a different game plan to a Jordan / Beauden / Harkin / McKenzie. You're not really counter-attacking or playmaking from fullback, you're playing a field position and high ball game. Jordie can play 15 like that too, so you do have a contingency option there.

I can't see it myself given Rennie's history (and I have a preference for running rugby), but it is an option that could work.

@Kiwiwomble said in Boks tour squad:

i find the Frizzell love so weird

So do I but you can pen him, Mounga and Beauden into the Bok squad bar injury. They are gonna be there. The question is what role will all 3 be playing.

@Kiwiwomble said in Boks tour squad:

i find the Frizzell love so weird, i copped so much flack back before i saw the light, 99% of people thought he was rubbish in the black jersey and were desperate to see him dropped...and now we think a few years playing in Japan will have made him better prepared to face the Bokke?

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@frugby said in Boks tour squad:

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@frugby said in Boks tour squad:

@Chris said in Boks tour squad:

@pakman said in Boks tour squad:

Aotearoa Pod confidently talking about 44 players.
27/17 split?

I am picking a 26/18 split

4 hookers
8 props
6 locks
8 loose forwards
4 HBs
3 1st fives
5 centres
4 wings
2 FBs

a couple of utilities in the backs.

Hookers: C Taylor, Taukei'aho, Aumua, G Bell (J Taylor next cab)
Props: de Groot, Numia, Norris, Tu'ungafasi, Newell, Tosi, Lomax, Ta'avao (Williams injured?)
Locks: Holland, S Barrett, Lord, Vaa'i, Darry, Tuipulotu (Ah Kuoi next cab)
Loose Forwards: Parker, Savea, Lakai, Sititi, Kirifi, Jacobson, Lio-Willie, Segner (Think there is room for a massive bolter here + Frizell if available)
Halfbacks: Roigard, Ratima, Hotham, Christie
First Fives: McKenzie, Perofeta, Love
Midfielders: Tupaea, J Barrett, Ioane, A Lienert-Brown, Procter
Wingers: Clarke, Tangitau, Carter, Narawa
Fullbacks: Jordan, B Barrett

I've gone with the below: Mafileo over Ta'avao, B Barrett at 10 over Perofeta, Harkin as a 15, Preston instead of Christie, Fainganuku instead of Ioane as a centre, Ioane to the wing, Beehre in as a lock/6, Bower over Tu'ungafasi

Hookers: C Taylor, Taukei'aho, Aumua, G Bell
Props: de Groot, Numia, Norris, Bower, Newell, Tosi, Lomax, Mafileo
Locks: Holland, S Barrett, Lord, Vaa'i, Darry, Tuipulotu, Beehre
Loose Forwards: Parker, Savea, Lakai, Sititi, Kirifi, Jacobson, Lio-Willie, Segner
Halfbacks: Roigard, Ratima, Hotham, Preston
First Fives: McKenzie, B Barrett, Love
Midfielders: Tupaea, J Barrett, Proctor, Fainganuku, Leinert-Brown
Wingers: Clarke, Tangitau, Ioane, Narawa, Carter
Fullbacks: Jordan, C Harkin

Forgot about Mafileo… think people are sleeping on Perofeta. I see them picking Sullivan before Harkin.

Harkin a good wee player, but he absolutely reeks to me of a guy who is playing above his station because he has great players around him and is in a good system. Need more at test level.

I don't get the hype around Sullivan, big boot yes, not too bad under the high ball, but his attacking game is a bit meh. His brother is definitely superior in that regard.

i think the way i see this kind of thing is, are there other that can spark attack?....yes....would a big boot be a benefit and something we haven't had in abundance...yes...so would be a net improvement

In normal AB loosie circumstances, it would be weird - but given how our loosies have been either underpowered or underwhelming (or both) for 2 years... not so much.
I do think we can do better, but he'd make a squad.

@Canes4life Not at all just my opinion.

@george33 said in Boks tour squad:

@Canes4life Not at all just my opinion.

I find it hard to tell what's your opinion versus a statement that you've heard from your source.

@Canes4life that's definitely my opinion.
Just aren't doing it for me , just my take on it .
Very congested area.

@george33 said in Boks tour squad:

@Canes4life that's definitely my opinion.
Just aren't doing it for me , just my take on it .
Very congested area.

You're allowed your opinion mate, I just thought you heard something.

@Canes4life No not at all .

@Chris said in Boks tour squad:

Gardiner could be looked at

I wouldn't be adverse to this if he consistently plays with the form.he's starting to show this season. Play dominating rugby in the finals and he should be included in the squad.

I heard a fairly reliable source say both Kirifi and Lakai are going to have to step up their game to make the squad.

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@Chris said in Boks tour squad:

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@Chris said in Boks tour squad:

Those teams speculated on further up the thread look a lot like rinse and repeat from the last 3 years.
I am not sure the results are going to be much better with the same players.

We have no choice to go with similar players to previous years because all the talent playing well in Super Rugby right now are leaving because they weren't selected in previous seasons.

Aside from Frizzell and Mo'unga, who would you have in there?

Yeah a major problem your side is close to what I would like to see.

Mounga for Harkin
Frizell for Jacobsen
Gardiner could be looked at
Probably not a lot else when I look.

Really there are too many players not up to it we have to select which is my worry.
The SA tour could be brutal as far as results go.

If Mo'unga is available this might be an unpopular opinion, but I'd take Harkin over BB.

If the ultimate goal is to prepare our players for the WC next year, then why take someone who's going to be even further over the hill in 18 months time.

Hmmm, Gardiner isn't imposing enough for an AB eight. Definitely the key ingredient this AB side is missing.

I wouldn't mind Harkin over BB.
Gardiner a 6 not really an 8, he throws his body around high work rate, Worth a look for a physical presence.

This thread is also very funny because it is everyone agreeing on 90% players, and then favouring their own franchise players for the rest.

@antipodean said in Boks tour squad:

I heard a fairly reliable source say both Kirifi and Lakai are going to have to step up their game to make the squad.

George as a source doesn't count.

@canefan said in Boks tour squad:

@Grooter said in Boks tour squad:

@frugby I have a Sixth sense Perofeta's time in nz rugby is drawing to a close, in which event Callum Harkin will have his phone nearby

Perofeta either never kicked on, or wasn't given much opportunity, or both. Time to look at Harkin, who has been quietly brilliant for the Canes this season

Yep mate, I not sure I see the point of Perofeta going, I like the idea of a Harkin, but not sure he has got ability to step up. I would think Mounga will get a spot, But will be interesting to see who makes squad.

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@antipodean said in Boks tour squad:

I heard a fairly reliable source say both Kirifi and Lakai are going to have to step up their game to make the squad.

Care to share who the source is? Pretty odd statement considering they've both been apart of the best performing loose trio in the comp.

Even harsher on Lakai who's arguably been the most consistent loose forward from the very beginning of the season.

I call bullshit considering we aren't flush with options right now.

Source was George.

@frugby said in Boks tour squad:

This thread is also very funny because it is everyone agreeing on 90% players, and then favouring their own franchise players for the rest.

except probably the highlanders fans....not sure we're advocating for many outside the obvious like Tangitau

@antipodean said in Boks tour squad:

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@antipodean said in Boks tour squad:

I heard a fairly reliable source say both Kirifi and Lakai are going to have to step up their game to make the squad.

Care to share who the source is? Pretty odd statement considering they've both been apart of the best performing loose trio in the comp.

Even harsher on Lakai who's arguably been the most consistent loose forward from the very beginning of the season.

I call bullshit considering we aren't flush with options right now.

Source was George.

View image

George was source

@Dan54 said in Boks tour squad:

@canefan said in Boks tour squad:

@Grooter said in Boks tour squad:

@frugby I have a Sixth sense Perofeta's time in nz rugby is drawing to a close, in which event Callum Harkin will have his phone nearby

Perofeta either never kicked on, or wasn't given much opportunity, or both. Time to look at Harkin, who has been quietly brilliant for the Canes this season

Yep mate, I not sure I see the point of Perofeta going, I like the idea of a Harkin, but not sure he has got ability to step up. I would think Mounga will get a spot, But will be interesting to see who makes squad.

Only one way to find out...

Iose maybe in with a shout and also I really like Chay fihaki this year. Seems to have improved a lot

would make more sense using Iose as a hybrid than LF

@ploughboy said in Boks tour squad:

would make more sense using Iose as a hybrid than LF

I dunno about that. The way the game is played these days there are a shitload of backs who are pretty solid breakdown players, but there are not many forwards who could position and defend effectively at centre or wing.

@reprobate said in Boks tour squad:

@ploughboy said in Boks tour squad:

would make more sense using Iose as a hybrid than LF

I dunno about that. The way the game is played these days there are a shitload of backs who are pretty solid breakdown players, but there are not many forwards who could position and defend effectively at centre or wing.

Iose is probably one of the loosies in NZ that wouldn't look out of place in the centres or on the wing if required. Oli Mathis, Lakai and Savea are others. The latter two played in the backs when they were at college so wouldn't be too far out the gate.

Iose's call for the ball on Saturday against the Crusaders, the speed to beat his opposite and then the banana kick over the top for Roigard's try was top notch.

@Canes4life said in Boks tour squad:

@reprobate said in Boks tour squad:

@ploughboy said in Boks tour squad:

would make more sense using Iose as a hybrid than LF

I dunno about that. The way the game is played these days there are a shitload of backs who are pretty solid breakdown players, but there are not many forwards who could position and defend effectively at centre or wing.

Iose is probably one of the loosies in NZ that wouldn't look out of place in the centres or on the wing if required. Oli Mathis, Lakai and Savea are others. The latter two played in the backs when they were at college so wouldn't be too far out the gate.

Iose's call for the ball on Saturday against the Crusaders, the speed to beat his opposite and then the banana kick over the top for Roigard's try was top notch.

And how is his positioning in the back field? His reading of when to come in and when to stay out? I think there are plenty of forwards who can look good attacking against backs, but not many at all who can look good defending against quality backs in space.
If you think Jordan, Fineanganofo, Clarke, Tangitau would rip them apart in a bit of space, or a good kicking 10 would make them look silly with 50-22s etc, then they really shouldn't be there - there's nowhere to hide in the open spaces.

@reprobate said in Boks tour squad:

@ploughboy said in Boks tour squad:

would make more sense using Iose as a hybrid than LF

I dunno about that. The way the game is played these days there are a shitload of backs who are pretty solid breakdown players, but there are not many forwards who could position and defend effectively at centre or wing.

considering LF defensive issues I would still back Iose.

will add I don't believe either player ranks high enough in there core role to be really considered for the bench

@ploughboy said in Boks tour squad:

will add I don't believe either player ranks high enough in there core role to be really considered for the bench

Oh I wouldn't pick LF in midfield, defense and ball security are not good enough. I just think you can hide individual deficiencies more in the pack than for someone like Iose in the backs. You can have a player who plays the 'Savea' role (for want of a better word) in a pack - sure it changes the workload for others, but it doesn't directly leave gaps for tries scored like deliberately giving the opposition backline a mismatch does.

If we want someone to play that LF role, Tavatavanawai would seem a far better option to me. He's a similar power runner, but he's definitely better over the ball, he definitely doesn't lose possession anywhere near as much, and he definitely doesn't miss as many tackles.

@reprobate said in Boks tour squad:

@ploughboy said in Boks tour squad:

will add I don't believe either player ranks high enough in there core role to be really considered for the bench

Oh I wouldn't pick LF in midfield, defense and ball security are not good enough. I just think you can hide individual deficiencies more in the pack than for someone like Iose in the backs. You can have a player who plays the 'Savea' role (for want of a better word) in a pack - sure it changes the workload for others, but it doesn't directly leave gaps for tries scored like deliberately giving the opposition backline a mismatch does.

If we want someone to play that LF role, Tavatavanawai would seem a far better option to me. He's a similar power runner, but he's definitely better over the ball, he definitely doesn't lose possession anywhere near as much, and he definitely doesn't miss as many tackles.

LF has improved this year in defense and ball security quite a lot.